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Post by theplague on Mar 5, 2017 10:38:06 GMT -5
Almost everyone on this forum was happy with the series, but obviously no adaptation is perfect and there's always going to be something you wish they did differently. I have a few:
- I like the overall visual style they used for the show, but I wish they didn't go with obvious cgi. I would have preferred obvious miniatures, matte paintings, forced perspectives, and stop motion.
- I wish Gustav was still drowned in a swamp, if only because I like swamps and wanted to see one in the show.
- I thought the Finite Forest was too normal looking and didn't really match the rest of the show.
- I didn't like the way they handled the scene where Count Olaf "saves" them from the leeches at all. I'm not sure why, something felt off the whole time. I think the movie did that scene much better.
- I wish they cut out some of the unnecessary scenes from The Wide Window Part One and had it end with the children discovering the code in the note.
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Post by zinthaniel on Mar 5, 2017 15:02:41 GMT -5
I'll admit I'm never a fan of "What did you not like" threads since I always disagree with people's points and want to argue them.
But what the hell, I'll be a good sport.
- I felt the show captured what Daniel infused into the books quite well, largely because Handler wrote much of it - my only grip is the exectuaion of performances and no I'm not referring to NPH, i think he was great.
My issue is with the children Malina and Louis. They simply were not good and I've moved pass blaming the script for it, kind of. They need to hone their acting and improve upon it or they will forever be, for me at least, a distraction.
Violet needs more stoicism and a bit of a sarcastic bite, but that's my personal interpretation of her. Malina played here a bit to ditsy and bubbly for my taste.
And Louise just needs to improve on his line delivery all together. It was too wooden in so many scenes.
That's my disappointment - luckily there were glimmers of improvement as the season went on, so I have high hopes for next season.
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Post by theplague on Mar 5, 2017 23:18:35 GMT -5
I'll admit I'm never a fan of "What did you not like" threads since I always disagree with people's points and want to argue them. But what the hell, I'll be a good sport. I don't mind if you want to argue any of my points. They're pretty stupid as far as complaints go.
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Post by ironic impostor on Mar 6, 2017 0:33:51 GMT -5
I'd say my biggest disappointment is that the show doesn't seen to use the medium of film as cleverly as the books used the medium of books.
I mean yes, Lemony talking to the camera is great and I'm a proponent of Olaf turning to it to address the audience about the convenience of streaming television (even though I know for some those jokes were a little too meta considering they weren't coming from Lemony). In those regards, and in many others, the show is plenty clever.
Rather, what I'm talking about is that I don't think it necessarily uses the idea of being captured on a visual medium with its own set of rules and traditions to the fullest effect that it could. There aren't really moments in which Lemony does much that's interesting regarding the particular format he's appearing in (turning the camera away from the Very Fancy Door in Episode 7 is a fun and welcome exception).
The scenes are rarely staged in ways that are particularly interesting from a visual standpoint. The cinematography and production design are top notch, don't misunderstand me, but really pay attention to what the actors are doing. Quite often, they're relatively still, kind of just talking at each other.
I know that the point I'm trying to make probably still isn't very clear, despite my attempts to explain myself, but I just feel like it could use its medium in a more interesting way. One of my favorite parts of the books is that the medium of presentation itself was often part of the joke. Repeated sentences and entire pages of nothing but black ink or "ever"s, I can't recall many jokes or gags in the tv series that have that same kind of impact. Is the show still funny and Lemony's presence still much appreciated and felt? Of course! I live the show and think it's wonderful (I'm currently in the middle of my sixth watch-through and am writing a spec-script for it in one of my film school classes!), I just think there are things it could do to really use its mode of presentation in really visually interesting and fascinating ways that it hasn't quite taken full advantage of yet. It's, in reality, a very small gripe, but one I have felt as I rewatch the show again and again.
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Post by doetwin on Mar 6, 2017 1:00:51 GMT -5
What bothered me was how Count Olaf ordered the Hook-Handed Man(aka Fernald), to drop Sunny, even after Violet had(supposedly) did what he wanted and married him. I can understand why this change was made. They wanted to make Count Olaf more sinister, and may have felt that he would come off as a softy for ordering Sunny to be brought safely to theater, as happens in the book. Count Olaf is a liar, cheater, and murderer and him ordering Sunny to be killed despite Violet following his orders does seem to match his character more. But here's my problem with this change. Count Olaf is almost as clever as he is evil. In the book, by freeing Sunny as soon as Violet gave him what he wanted, he was demonstrating the power that he held over the Baudelaires(in that their lives were there reward for following his orders). Also, the Count Olaf in the book realized that committing murder in front of an entire audience would warrant him a life-sentence and he wouldn't be able to enjoy the fortune that he had worked so hard to supposedly obtain. He certainly did not free Sunny out of fairness, but rather out of a desire to save himself and show off.
The main problem with this change is that it required both Count Olaf and Fernald to act out of character. Before Fernald is reunited with his sister, he is supposed to be almost as despicable as Count Olaf and is supposed to hate the Baudelaires as much as Count Olaf, but playing cards with Sunny does not make it seem like he hates her. But what's even more-so is that he brings her down from the tower despite his boss having told him not to do so until after the wedding. The Fernald in the book would never have disobeyed Count Olaf. After the first two episodes, it's very difficult to take Fernald seriously as a villain and a threat. The Count Olaf in the book would have fired an associate had they disobeyed him, but in the tv show, Count Olaf didn't punish Fernald in any way, so their attempt to inflate Olaf's villainy was counter-productive.
Another problem I had was how horrible an actor Count Olaf was when posing as Stephano. For instance, he threw a knife at the children before Uncle Monty got home, and then flat-out admitted it to Uncle Monty and came up with some lame cover story, even though he didn't have to tell Uncle Monty anything about a knife. In the book, Count Olaf throws a lamp at Uncle Monty through a window and hides his face before Monty can spot him, causing him to blame Klaus. But in the show, he makes no attempt to hide his face and again, comes up with a lame cover story by saying he was just being careless. In the book, we can Mr. Poe a pass for falling for Count Olaf's disguise as Stephano, but in the show, Mr. Poe has no excuse.
This last one is a casting decision. I had absolutely no problem with the Quagmires making an appearance before TAA, but I did have a problem with Duncan and Quigley being played by the same actor. This casting decision is based on the assumption that Duncan and Quigley are identical when the book strongly implies the contrary. Our first piece of evidence is when Quigley introduces himself to Violet and Klaus in TSS:
“You're dead,” Violet said, and took off her mask to make sure she was seeing things clearly. But there was no mistaking Quigley, even though the Baudelaires had never seen him before. He looked so much like Duncan and Isadora that he could only be the third Quagmire triplet.
“You perished in a fire along with your parents,” Klaus said, but as he took off his mask he knew this wasn't so. Quigley was even giving the two Baudelaires a small smile that looked exactly like his siblings'.
If Quigley had looked exactly like Duncan, the Violet and Klaus would have at-least suspected that he was Duncan, rather than feeling so sure that he really had survived the fire. But they didn't think anything the lines of, "Had Quigley actually survived the fire, or was this just Duncan pretending to be Quigley?" Between Quigley survivng the fire when he was supposed to have died and Duncan getting down from the SSHAMH, the latter is much more probable, and that is the conclusion Violet and Klaus would have made had Quigley looked just like Duncan. Then later:
The two Baudelaires nodded at one another, and then turned to see that Quigley was nodding, too, and the three children reached up and took off their masks for the greater good.
Count Olaf's mouth dropped open in surprise. “You're dead!” he said to the eldest Baudelaire, saying something that he knew full well was ridiculous. “You perished in the caravan, along with Klaus!”
Esmé stared at Klaus, looking just as astonished as her boyfriend. “You're dead, too!” she cried. “You fell off a mountain!”
“And you're one of those twins!” Olaf said to Quigley. “You died a long time ago!”
Again, if Quigley had looked just like Duncan, Count Olaf would have said something along the lines of, "I thought you were on a hot-air balloon with your stupid sister and that handyman fool, Hector."
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Post by Strangely on Mar 10, 2017 23:53:55 GMT -5
I think most of my disappointments came down to the pacing and editing. Klaus's line about Mr. Poe seeming scary in the fog doesn't make sense (unless there's Stephen King levels of fog) and it slows down the scene (which there's really no reason for, it adds nothing, it's not like it's there to let a moment land or something, it's just pandering to the book zealots). Then the recapping in episode 2 goes on too long and that scene with Olaf at the bank, while funny, holds up the plot considerably. I can see the merit of having it to introduce Jacequelyn, but it goes on a bit too long and it's placement in the story doesn't quite feel right since at this point we're still waiting for the resolve of Klaus being slapped. Then we get to TRR and at times it feels like we missed a scene. It strange having the Baudelaire's being concerned about Ink being blamed for Monty's death when there was only one scene of it prior.
But once we get to TWW part 2 it becomes terrible. That first scene is just the last scene of the previous scene with slightly different dialogue. Then the forgery scene goes on way too long. The Venus Flytrap monologue shows up to halt the story completely, proving to be the most pointless bit of narration in the entire series. It doesn't inform us of anything we don't know, nor is it particularly amusing or clever. The Anxious Clown scene ends up being pretty good, but once again narration slows it down (as well as the standard "he's Olaf!" accusations, but at least that serves a purpose, however tedious and repetitive it becomes), the first half of the allergy monologue should have been cut. Then the note decoding goes on too long, Violet stating the facts out loud is particularly annoying as the phrasing and delivery is more as if it's for the audiences benefit over the characters benefit. The movie, to it's credit, figured out how to distill this information without spoon feeding it to the audience.
But what suffers the most from poor editing is the destruction of Aunt Josephine's house. Klaus being flung out the window is resolved by an updraft almost instantly, which really ruins any sense of actual peril that was brewing, they could have lingered for a few seconds longer, maybe showed the rug beginning to rip or something. Then despite the music speeding up and the camera work intensifying as they run out of the house they linger on the shot of them running out the door for so long, once again slowing down the scene and ruining the buildup they had just managed. It's sad because the buildup was actually working; the lime slowly rolling, the house suddenly pitching downwards and the Baudelaire's running, but then it's all ruined by several seconds of them very slowly opening a door and stepping out to look at the camera. I'll admit there's no fast way of running out of a closed door, but some basic editing would have fixed this. After the Baudelaire's ran through the hallway the editor should have cut to the wider shot of the house tipping then resumed with the door already opened and them stumbling out, cutting before they look at the camera to a final wide shot of the house crumbling and then immediately cut to the final plunge with the children turning around. The editor really let the momentum drop.
It gets immensely better after this, with the editing and pacing becoming really quite good, but whoever was in charge of that first twenty minutes of the episode was off their game.
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Post by colette on Jun 23, 2018 5:27:41 GMT -5
Well, generally the show was much less dissapointing to me than the movie was. But there were some things that dissapointed me. For example, I disliked the Madam Lulu subplot. I also disliked that they gave the bald man's line about not wanting to work with freaks to Fernald. I think that this line makes no sense in the show where nobody but Lulu died. I think that in books that line was meaningful and symbolic. It's symbolic that the bald man, the one who was too proud to work with freaks and wanting to prevent them from joining Olaf, died at Caligari Carnival(IMO). Be careful of what you wish for...
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Post by colette on Jun 28, 2018 12:11:32 GMT -5
W The main problem with this change is that it required both Count Olaf and Fernald to act out of character. Before Fernald is reunited with his sister, he is supposed to be almost as despicable as Count Olaf and is supposed to hate the Baudelaires as much as Count Olaf, but playing cards with Sunny does not make it seem like he hates her. But what's even more-so is that he brings her down from the tower despite his boss having told him not to do so until after the wedding. The Fernald in the book would never have disobeyed Count Olaf. After the first two episodes, it's very difficult to take Fernald seriously as a villain and a threat. I suppose that those changes to Fernald's personality were made to make his redemption more realistic( from the creators' point of view). I have no problems with book Fernald, the freakish trio and Kit are the only canon characters I love more than him. I guess that Baudelaires just remembered that Hector's baloon can't land. But Olaf's reaction seems to proof that you are right. Yes, the canon never states that Duncan and Quigley look identical. It was stated that Quigley looks very much like Duncan. But "very much like" doesn't mean "identical". Note that we never see Quagmire brothers together. I guess it's easier to notice the differences between two people standing next near each other rather than between person you have just met and the person you haven't seen for a long time. My own cousins are twins and look very much alike but aren't indentical.
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Post by doetwin on Sept 25, 2018 5:20:51 GMT -5
I didn't realize that this thread could be applied to Season 2 until I saw Colette's post.
I must say that my biggest pet peeve is Mr. Poe being added into scenes that he wasn't in in the books. In the books, Mr. Poe's astounding stupidity was funny at first, but it got pretty old by TVV. In fact, I'm not sure I would have even made it through the series had I not gotten a 3-book break from him. It's so obvious that the reason Netflix is shoehorning him in is so that he can blurt out more idiotic comments and continue to swallow the BS cover-up stories from Olaf and his comrades in the hopes of getting a laugh out of the audience. There are scenes where Olaf has undisguised comrades in front of Mr. Poe, and he thinks nothing of it, and he actually believes that there are two "Count Olafs" with unibrows and a theater troupe. Mr. Poe being a bumbling oblivious idiot was a message that the books beat to death. Netflix has taken that message and smashed it to bits. There's only so many times the same joke can be funny. At the end of season, he does say that he is headed back to MMM, which I'm hoping will mean he's not going to make an appearance Mount Fraught.
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Post by Foxy on Sept 25, 2018 8:17:25 GMT -5
I see what you mean about Mr. Poe, doetwin. I think it added something to the books when he disappeared for a long time and showed up on the beach again at the end of TGG, just like at the beginning of TBB.
I am not a fan of violence, but I am really disappointed the henchmen aren't dying. There are too many of them now, and I thought it was extremely meaningful when the white faced women left Olaf at the end of TSS and walked away, and I don't see how they are going to fit that into the show when they haven't been setting that scene up with the other henchmen also exiting the picture, unless they just all decide to up and abandon Olaf at the top of the mountain.
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Post by deathtentaclesandpip on Oct 22, 2018 14:20:32 GMT -5
I am not a fan of violence, but I am really disappointed the henchmen aren't dying. There are too many of them now, and I thought it was extremely meaningful when the white faced women left Olaf at the end of TSS and walked away, and I don't see how they are going to fit that into the show when they haven't been setting that scene up with the other henchmen also exiting the picture, unless they just all decide to up and abandon Olaf at the top of the mountain. Yeah I'm not a huge fan of this change either but they're definitely stuck with everyone (except Fernald) abandoning Olaf during The Slippery Slope, so I guess we'll have to see how that plays out. I'm sure they'll handle it well.
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Post by Mr. Dent on Oct 31, 2018 15:31:58 GMT -5
After having read TIHOSO, I'm disappointed Cliffhanger was scrapped, and we were left with Chasing Your Schemes and Welcome to the House of Freaks instead. (Two songs I actually quite dislike.)
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vin
Bewildered Beginner
Posts: 1
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Post by vin on Dec 17, 2018 14:07:27 GMT -5
Hey, I’m totally new here but I’ve been rewatching Season 2 in preparation for January and I’m finding myself irritated by some things. My main problem with Season 2 is the near constant music. It makes things seem far too crowded and sloppy. Like, if they had just not included the backing music in many of the scenes, things would seem a lot more professional. Season 1 had more moments of silence throughout its episodes, and, not by coincidence, more laugh-out-loud moments. Jokes don’t land as well when music muddies them. I’m hoping Season 3 won’t overuse the soundtrack, but it doesn’t seem likely considering there was dramatic music in the SAUNA scene, which is supposed to be awkward.
TAA suffers reaaaally badly from this problem. It’s a real shame, too, especially considering that I really do enjoy these episodes—the way they look, the characters and all that. It’s just that the music crowds everything. The most memorable moments for me are the awkward silence when the Baudelaires first enter Nero’s office, and the scene with Lemony and Jacques whistling together in the taxi. That scene cuts to Olaf making the Quagmires run, which is silent and nice for a moment but lapses right back into the cheesy soundtrack!! And when Fernald is telling Olaf about the flour on his face, one line in and then music again! Someone being awkwardly told they have flour on their face doesn’t need a dramatic orchestral score.... and the Baudelaires studying, and... urgh, just nothing lands properly when there’s Impending Doom Strings playing ALL THE TIME.
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Post by colette on Sept 12, 2019 8:55:08 GMT -5
I have one not minor but very major dissapointment about season 3... FREAKS!!! I felt like I am a widow.
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Post by worldonfire on May 10, 2020 7:23:34 GMT -5
A couple of minor ones: - Everything about the horribly edited scored and shot "Aunt Josephine escapes by pretending to jump out of a window" scene in TWW - The botched tattoo shot in TAA, that was too important a shot for the second unit crew to get wrong - Olaf's writing in early scenes of TSS part 1 which was a bit flat - The freaks treatment in S3 - Jacquelyn being written out and Larry not getting a lot of love in S3 - The Pacing of TE, which sort of felt like it had 3 endings, but kept going every time
Despite these flaws, I absolutely adore the show. In the end, the people working on this are only human, and they tried to give us the best show possible. I think they succeeded.
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