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Post by veryferociousdrama on Apr 14, 2019 13:51:52 GMT -5
Be seen reading and writing, and not be heard!
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Post by Foxy on Apr 15, 2019 8:42:39 GMT -5
Personal Notes:
How do these kids not die of starvation or sleep deprivation?
Why does Violet choose the name “Sally”? (3)
You can lead a horse to water painting is funny. (4)
Violet comments on one of the Quagmire scraps of notebook with dates, saying “It looks like something was going on every twelve weeks or so.” What is that about? (5)
You know, I can see what Mr. Poe meant about being skeptical that Count Olaf would follow them everywhere to get their fortune. Who works this hard for something?
I think the survivor was a parent, and not referring to Quigley Quagmire. (6)
I love the dialogue between Klaus and Sunny. We don’t get this anywhere else. (9)
How do you go to prison four and a half times? (10)
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THE HOSTILE HOSPITAL
CHARACTERS:
Violet Baudelaire
Klaus Baudelaire/Dr. Tocuna
Sunny Baudelaire/ Nurse Flo
Count Olaf/Mattathias
Mr. Poe (mentioned) (1)
Milt (1)
Duncan Quagmire (mentioned) (1)
Isadora Quagmire (mentioned) (1)
Quagmire parents (mentioned) (1)
Quigley Quagmire (mentioned) (1)
Lou (2)
Volunteers Fighting Disease (2): a friendly looking man with a guitar, cheerful men, cheerful women, a handful of cheerful children, a cheerful driver
Beatrice (mentioned) (2)
Esmé Gigi Geniveve Squalor
William Congreve (2): playwright who wrote “Music has charms to soothe a savage breast.”
Jacques Snicket (mentioned) (2)
Snicket’s friend who plays the pipe organ (3)
Babs (3): head of human resources, never seen, was thrown off a building by Count Olaf.
Hal (4)
Thomas Alva Edison (7)
a man with both legs in casts (8)
a woman with both arms in badages (8)
Bernard Rieux (8): plague ward patient in room 105
Cynthia Vane (8): had a toothache
Jonah Mapple (8): Room 201, seasickness
Charley Anderson (8): Room 714, injured in an accident (there is also a children’s story about a cat named Charlie Anderson)
Clarissa Dalloway (8): Room 1308, suffering from depression?
Emma Bovery (8): Room 2611, food poisoning
Mikhail Bulgakov (8)
Haruki Murakami (8)
Mr. Sirin (10): lepidopterist
four officers in bright pink uniforms (10): chasing Mr. Sirin in story
Hospital Guard/person who looked like neither a man nor a woman (10)
Hook-handed man/Dr. O. Lucafont (10)
Bald man/Dr. Flacutono (10)
doctors, nurses, administrators
Colonel James Bowie (11)
Daily Punctilio reporter (11): Geraldine Julien?
the white-faced women/ real Dr. Tocuna & Nurse Flo (11)
Count Omar (11)
VIOLET’S INVENTION:
Bungee cord (13)
KLAUS’S RESEARCH:
anagrams (9)
SUNNY’S BITING:
opening soup (9), biting Violet’s neck
THE LIBRARY:
Library of Records
SNICKET SECRETS:
He was locked in an Italian restaurant slowly filling up with water and has acquaintances in the locksmith, pasta, and sponge businesses. (1)
He was crouching behind the altar of the Catherdral of the Alleged Virgin while a friend of his played a sonata on a pipe organ while he was writing part of this book. (3)
His father used to sing a tune when he did the dishes (3)
He pled with his dentist to hollow out one of his teeth so he could smuggle a single page of his latest book past the guards at an airport. (4)
He researched Hal for nine months, six days, and fourteen hours to discover Hal was not a spy. (4)
He says the men and women of V.F.D. had their lives wrecked by a greedy man and a lazy newspaper. (5)
A prison warden is his friend and he had to get this chapter written quickly, or he would drown. (5)
He walks on the decks of ships, looks through a telescope at the aurora borealis, and hides his books on the top shelves at bookstores so no one will buy and read them. (6)
He stole the sugarbowl from Esmé Squalor. (6)
He cried himself to sleep years after the photograph of himself, Jacques, and the Baudelaire parents was taken. (6)
He had a friend, Mr. Sirin, who collected butterflies and was chased by the police. Mr. Sirin swallowed the butterflies and went to prison, and he couldn’t eat large chunks of broccoli, or he would crush the butterflies. (10)
He read a book on how to have a successful marriage, but the woman he loved perished on a terrible afternoon. (11)
He was once a content man with a comfortable home, successful career, person he loved very much, and a typewriter. Now he just has a tattoo on his left ankle. He is in a tiny room with a large pencil. (12)
REFERENCES (real and made up):
The Daily Punctilio (1)
The Butcher Boy
Sleeping Beauty (10)
A Complete History of Surgical Tools (11)
What Happens to Wet Metal (11)
SNICKETISMS:
the one about STOP (1)
the one about “no news is good news” (2)
the one about hopping (2)
the one about how imagining something doesn’t make it so (3)
the one about standing outside the door of an office (4)
the one about snapping your fingers and grinning (4)
the one about subconscious word associations (5)
the one about things being easier said than done (5)
the one about supply closets being an uncomfortable place to hide (8)
the one about operating theatres (11)
the one about there being many things he doesn’t know (13)
BAUDELAIRE FAMILY HISTORY:
Beatrice attended afternoon tea one Thursday and met Esmé Squalor for the first time. (2)
The Baudelaires’ father used to call Violet “Ed.” (7)
Their mother’s coat had a secret pocket in it in which she kept a small pocket dictionary. She promised to one day give the dictionary to Klaus. (7)
The parents used to sing a song to Sunny called “The Butcher Boy.” Their mother’s voice was breathing and high, and their father’s voice was low and deep as a foghorn. (7)
Sunny learned how to open cans by opening a can of condensed milk so her father could finish making frosting for her mother’s birthday cake. Sunny’s first word was “bite.” She opened all the cans from then on, except for beets. (9)
When she was five years old, Violet won an invention contest with an automatic rolling pin. (13)
SNICKET DICTIONARY:
As comfortable as they could: not very comfortable at all (5)
Audacity: attempt to steal valuables from hospital employees, in addition to snatching the Baudelaire fortune (6)
Cruel twist of fate: nothing has happened the way I thought it would (12)
Dumbfoundedly: wondering why Klaus wanted to eat alphabet soup at a time like this (9)
Emphatically: as if she thought being extra careful was a very good plan (8)
Futile: useless, unnecessary, and ineffectual, because there is no reason for it (7)
Increase exponentially: get much, much worse (10)
Infiltrated: sneaked into the middle of a singing crowd (8)
Intercom: someone talking into a microphone someplace and having their voice come out of speakers someplace else (3)
Lepidopterist: a man who was being pursued by angry government officials (10)
Made short work: ate every warm, sweet crumb (2)
Reproving: shouting ‘Be silent!’ (4)
Severe lack of moral stamina: cruel selfishness combined with love of violence (12)
shoes with Stiletto heels: a pair of shoes made with a small, slender knife where each heel should be (7)
Slave to fashion: dressed in incredibly expensive, and often absurd, outfits (7)
Spurious: nothing at all like a real doctor (9)
Stepped to it: took their positions around the telegram device (1)
Ward: particular section of the hospital (8)
SUNNY SPEECH:
Afficu: And the only way we’ll get into the Library of Records is if we talk to Babs, so it’s a risk we have to take. (4)
Agery: Well, we can’t keep on walking forever. (1)
Alias: Maybe she’s under a different name. (8)
All done. (9)
Aronec: And we’re not getting any closer to learning anything about V.F.D., or Jacques Snicket. (3)
Arrete?: (Stop?) (1)
Asklu: We never would have found her if you hadn’t figured out that Olaf was using anagrams. (9)
Baudelaire! (6)
Blusin: We don’t have much choice. (2)
Bounce? (13)
But how? (9)
Ceyune: We’ve been wandering around the hospital all morning, and we’re no closer to rescuing our sister. (8)
Check! (9)
Chonex: Then we’re all alone. (1)
Clap! (11)
Climb? (13)
Culch!: Getting in the trunk is the same thing as getting captured! (13)
Curoy: Besides, the Quagmire triplets are far, far away, and we only have a few pages of their notebooks. We need to find the real meaning of V.F.D. (4)
Damajat: Let’s hide in that supply closet over there. (8)
Danger (8)
Danya: Or the bedroom at Count Olaf’s house. (4)
Deashew!: And it takes me several hours to open one cabinet with my teeth! (5)
Decap?: Do you thinkg hey’re going to cut off Violet’s head? (8)
Different. (13)
Disguise? (8)
Dleen!: We can’t continue down the staircase – look! (12)
Door! (12)
Douth?: But how are we going to find the Surgical Ward when the maps of the hospital are so confusing? (9)
Echinacea!: Or well-tested herbal remedies. (3)
Egress: Klaus is right – the exit is the other way. (7)
Ezan: Or find out if one of our parents really survived the fire. (13)
Gidoost: But piles of construction materials don’t wander around hospitals. (8)
Glaynop? (12)
Golos: Itll have to do, until something better comes along. (13)
Gwit: They don’t recognize us either. (10)
Gwito: But Mattathias closed the Surgical Ward. (9)
Gykree!: He’s had all night to contact us, and we haven’t heard from him. (2)
Half: (We could sleep in the unfinished half of the hospital.) (4)
Help!: (I’ll help!) (1); (13)
Hend: Actually, I worked as an administrative assistant at Prufrock Preparatory School. (4)
Ilimi: (I’m scared.) (1)
Impro: We’ll think of something. (2)
Jacques! (1)
Janitor. (6)
Kesalf: That’s Olaf’s associate. It sounds like it’s entering the Ward for People with Nasty Rashes. We’d better hurry. (13)
Knife? (11)
Lindersto: That’ll be tough. We’ll have to wander around the hospital looking for her, while other people will be wandering around the hospital, looking for us. (8)
Me!: I’d be perfect for that job, because I have very sharp teeth. (4)
Mulick!: Let’s discuss that at a later time! (2)
Mushulm: I agree, although it won’t be pleasant to see all these sick people. (8)
Nersai: Jackline to Jacutinga (6)
Night! (5)
Nil. (5)
No! (7)
No up. (12)
No walk! (3)
Nroiz! (12)
O! (9)
Olaf: Before Mattathias gets his hands on us. (6)
Orlando!: Or the one who looks like neither a man nor a woman. (5)
Paperwork! (11)
Patsy: We’re very concerned about Laura V. Bleediotie. (10)
Peipix: Me neither. (9)
Pesh: At least, until somebody needs rubber bands, alphabet soup, white medical coats, or clean hands. (8)
Phromein: I think I understand, but it’s difficult for someone as young as myself. (9)
Pietrisycamollaviadelrechiotemexity: I must admit I don’t have the faintest idea of what is going on. (5)
Poe (1)
Prapil: (doubt) (7)
Prem!: But we looked under Snicket, Jacques, and Fire already. (6)
Quagmire: When the Quagmires used disguises, they didn’t fool Olaf. (9)
Rabave. (5)
Rallam: And Olaf’s associates are chasing us. (13)
Rance: (And the file.) (8)
Rats! (3)
Read it! (6)
Ready. (8)
Recazier?: Klaus, why in the world do you want to eat alphabet soup at a time like this? (9)
Right. (8)
Run! (7)
Seerg: And I was afraid to ask him any more about it. (5)
Sheer terror. (13)
Shh: Be quiet! I think I hear someone walking into the anteroom of the Library of Records. (6) (also sometimes – I think the H aisle might be a good place to look for the file.)
Silata: But there are so many people here. (9)
Sorry. (12)
Sos: It’s an emergency situation. (1)
Stairs! (12)
Stall: We’ll try to postpone the operation as long as we can, Klaus. (11)
Teeth. (11)
Tiofreck!: Violet’s in grave danger – we have to find her immediately. (8)
Tell! (5)
Together. (13)
Torch? (10)
Trapped. (10)
Treen: Yes – I opened one earlier, to help decode the anagrams. (13)
Trosslik: You mean if Mr. Poe gets us out of this mess. (1)
True. (9)
Tweem!: (We’re not murderers!) (11)
Twisp: But not until we get ahold of the file, solve all these mysteries, and prove our innocence. (6)
Uckner: (Meanwhile we discovered where the Quagmire triplets were being hidden, and helped them escape STOP. The Quagmires managed to give us a few scraps of their notebooks so we could try to learn the real meaning of V.F.D. STOP.) (1)
Us: And we need to know why there’s a picture of us in the file. (5); (Except us.) (9)
Us, too! (11)
V? (9)
Vapey: Then let’s hurry. (6)
Velocity!: (We have to hurry!) (9)
Violet! (7)
Virm: But we don’t know where she is. (8)
Where? (12)
Wolick: We’re very happy to be of assistance. (4)
Yep. (4)
Yes! (10)
Yuck: Don’t remind me. (9)
GEOGRAPHY:
Last Chance General Store (1)
Mulctuary Money Management (mentioned) (1)
Cathedral of the Alleged Virgin (3)
Heimlich Hospital (3): if you want to see the remains of the place, you have to borrow a donkey, and the whole place is covered in kudzu
Damocles Dock (mentioned) (4)
Quivery Stomach Festival (6)
Texas (11)
Café Salmonella (mentioned) (12)
FOODOLOGY:
Limes (1)
Fresh cranberry muffins (2)
Fruit (4)
plum (5)
persimmon (5)
alphabet soup (9)
pizza (12)
Chinese food (12)
LIBRARY OF RECORDS FILES:
Babbit to Babylon (6)
Bacteria to Ballet (6)
Bamboo to Baskerville (6)
Bat Mitzvah to Bavarian Cream (6)
Byron to Byzantine (7)
Conch to Condy’s Fluid (7)
Confetti to Consecration (7) (congruent triangles, coniferous trees, conjugated verbs)
Fabian to Fact (6)
Fainting to Fangs (6)
famous Finnish fishermen (5)
Fatalism to Faulkner (6)
Fear to Fermat (6)
Ficus to Filth (6)
Fin de Siècle to Fissle (6) (Finland, firmament)
Jabberwocky to Jackal (6)
Jacket to Jack-o’-Lantern (6)
Jackline to Jacutinga (6) (jack-o’lantern (is that a mistake?), Jack Russell terrier, Jacobean drama)
Linguistic to Lions (7)
mollusks (5)
picture frames to pyramids (4)
poetry to pills (4)
protection of thumb (5)
pudding to psychology (4)
sauce to saxifrage (6) (sawmill, sauna)
scarab to scavenger (6)
secretary to sediment (6)
sequel to serenity (6)
sewing machines (5)
shed to sheepshank (6)
shellac to sherbert (6)
shipwreck to shrimp (6)
sicily to sideways (6)
skylight to slob (6)
sludge to smoke (6)
snack to snifter (6) (Snell’s Law, sneaker, snicking)
snowball to sober (6)
sonnet to spackle (6)
ANAGRAMS:
Lisa N. Lootnday – Alison Donalty
Albert E Deviloeia
Linda Rhaldeen – Daniel Handler
Ada O. Ubervillet
Ed Valiantbrue
Laura V. Bleediotie – Violet Baudelaire
Monty Kensicle – Lemony Snicket
Ned H. Rirger – Red Herring
Eriq Bluthetts – Brett Helquist
Ruth Dercroump
Al Brisnow – Lisa Brown
Carrie E. Abelabudite – Beatrice Baudelaire
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Post by Carrie E. Abelabudite on Apr 15, 2019 14:53:51 GMT -5
How do these kids not die of starvation or sleep deprivation? My biggest concern is dehydration - I don't think they're described as drinking anything this entire book. I think the most likely explanation is VFD meetings, though most of what we know about the organisation at the time of ASOUE suggests that it's very fragmented and there appears to be a lack of communication among members, so it does seem odd they'd be meeting so regularly. Maybe the list refers to meetings from a few years ago. I've also seen people theorise that these are the dates of fires, though I can't think of any reason why they'd be occurring at such regular intervals. While I don't think Handler ever intended to bring one of the Baudelaire parents back, there's enough that's contradictory regarding the survivor-of-the-fire plot line that really the only way to reconcile the story is to say that different evidence refers to different people, and one of the neatest fixes is to say there was a survivor of the Baudelaire fire. Maybe one time he escaped before he got there? I'm not sure if you could really count that as going to prison half a time, though.I think this is meant to refer to 'Rupert Murdoch', though I forget what his connection to the book was. General Notes
The first time I read this book, I had kind of a hard time with it. I think it was just because it was so different from everything that had come before - I had liked knowing what to expect, and seeing what would be different within the framework of the same formula. Even now, I think that this book and TCC fall into a somewhat awkward middle ground, after the original set-up of the series has been ditched, but before the Baudelaires properly become involved with VFD. They're sort of neither fish nor fowl. With that said, though, I think this book is better than any that precede it; an exciting glimpse into what the latter part of the series will look like. I prefer the Egmont cover; I just find the 'Violet's POV' aspect of the HarperCollins one slightly creepy, though I'll admit the way the blankets are folded around Violet in the Egmont version are sort of odd - it almost looks like she's pregnant. I also like the Egmont spine colour; I think the Egmont spine colours of this book through to TGG look really good together on a shelf. The dedication makes me think of Ike and Josephine's relationship. Chapter One
I like the telegram motif. So, okay, the sun was just setting when the children left VFD. Now it's 'early in the morning' - maybe around 5AM or so? This suggests that the Last Chance General Store is quite some distance from VFD, but we don't know how far it is from the city or other locations since we don't know which direction the Baudelaires have been walking, and I suppose they really couldn't have walked more than about thirty miles no matter what, which wouldn't be such a long way for someone driving. Also, they haven't had anything to drink in over forty-eight hours, plus they've just had their fourth sleepless night in a row, so I'm surprised they have the energy to walk at all. Maybe they're very slow due to their fatigued state, and therefore haven't actually got very far. 'if you were an author locked in an Italian restaurant that was slowly filling up with water, you might call upon your acquaintances in the locksmith, pasta and sponge business to come and rescue you.' Lemony's life keeps getting worse and worse, doesn't it? The description of all the items on sale at the Last Chance General Store could be seen as an introduction to the theme that the Baudelaires' is not the only story. Olaf and Esme arrived in town before Jacques was murdered, but given the Baudelaires' sleep deprivation/hunger/thirst, you really can't blame them for making this kind of mistake in their telegram. Do they really need to give Poe so much detail? Surely it's in their interest to be as brief as possible.
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Post by Dante on Apr 15, 2019 15:20:50 GMT -5
I think this is meant to refer to 'Rupert Murdoch', though I forget what his connection to the book was. He's the ultimate owner of HarperCollins, U.S. publishers of ASoUE; though for some years, "torch up murder" was also bandied around as an alternative...
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Post by Foxy on Apr 16, 2019 9:11:30 GMT -5
"Torch up murder" doesn't make much sense to me. It's just two somewhat violent words pieced together with a preposition. It makes as much sense as Perch Drum Tour. And at least then we would get to see fish playing musical instruments all over the world. Carrie E. Abelabudite : I never looked much at the Egmont covers before. Thank you for introducing them to me! I like the heart over Violet's face in this one.
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Post by Dante on Apr 16, 2019 10:32:15 GMT -5
"Torch up murder" doesn't make much sense to me. It's just two somewhat violent words pieced together with a preposition. It makes as much sense as Perch Drum Tour. And at least then we would get to see fish playing musical instruments all over the world. It was the best people could come up with, since Rupert Murdoch's connection to ASoUE is such a distant one compared to the rest. (Curious that designer Alison Donalty got in but Handler's long-time editor, Sue Rich, didn't; but then again her name has so many fewer letters.) Since we're in THH, incidentally, people also tried to mine "pietrisycamollaviadelrechiotemexity" for anagrams, to the point where I no longer have to look up that utterance's spelling.
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Post by Uncle Algernon on Apr 16, 2019 12:51:41 GMT -5
Curious that designer Alison Donalty got in but Handler's long-time editor Sue Rich didn't Doesn't she already have a cameo as The Kind Editor?
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Post by Dante on Apr 16, 2019 15:09:18 GMT -5
That's a fair contention, but I'm talking purely about names on the list of anagrams here. Much as Brett Helquist appears both on the list and in the U.A., so too I wouldn't be surprised to see Sue Rich appear both on the anagram list and in her regular capacity as the likely inspiration for the unnamed Kind Editor; I don't think Handler decides on his (very rare) cameos of people he knows by coolly tallying it up to a precise number of references each. I do think it's likely just a matter of her name being too short.
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Post by Carrie E. Abelabudite on Apr 16, 2019 15:58:13 GMT -5
Chapter Two
'No news is good news' is one of my favourites of Lemony's rants.
How long are the Baudelaires at the store? It still seems to be fairly early when they leave, probably not later than eight or nine, so it's not really surprising Poe wouldn't be at his office to reply to the telegraph.
I hope the Baudelaires got some water as well as the muffins Milt gave them - they must be nearly dying of dehydration at this point.
'"We're not murderers!" Violet cried in frustration.' Sure, give yourself away. That seems like a great move.
This is the first time the Baudelaires are in a situation where they have to choose between two bad situations, but this will be continued. It's interesting to note that this parallels but also contrasts the taxi driver in TPP - there, the Baudelaires choose to stay and be dealt with by the law.
'I would hop like nobody had ever hopped before, if I could somehow go back to that terrible Thursday, and stop Beatrice from attending that afternoon tea where she met Esmé Squalor for the first time.' I always find it striking that Beatrice and Esme literally met at a tea. Is this when the sugar bowl got stolen? That might have been what Handler was intending at the time, but I think it makes more sense to say that she was casing the joint and she/Lemony stole it later.
'Violet, Klaus and Sunny did not hop, because they were not plumbers fixing leaks, or sculptors finishing works of art, or authors magically erasing a series of unfortunate events.' So, this is the real first series title drop.
Chapter Three
The Volunteers Fighting Disease song is absolutely fantastic.
Is it possible that they ever had any link with the Volunteer Fire Department? The initials being the same seems odd, as coincidences go. Maybe the original incarnation of the Volunteers Fighting Disease were actually volunteer doctors or nurses, and the organisation got corrupted over time.
'Cathedral of the Alleged Virgin' always makes me laugh, because when I first read the book I completely thought it sounded like a legitimate name for a church. Also, seems like Lemony has managed to escape captivity and regain possession of his typewriter.
'The mournful melody of the sonata reminds me of a tune my father used to sing when he did the dishes,' A rare insight into Lemony's family life. Per TUA, he seems to have been recruited to VFD at such a young age you'd think he wouldn't remember too much about his family, but I guess if his intelligence was along the lines of Sunny's, maybe he'd be able to.
How fair is Heimlich Hospital from the Last Chance General Store? The store is supposedly the only building around for miles, but if the volunteers stop there every day, it can't be that far. Also, where do all the Volunteers live? Maybe just in various nearby towns.
'"I don't know anyone of [Jacques'] description," [the bearded volunteer] said, "and I've been with the Volunteers Fighting Disease since the organization first started."' Okay, this disrupts my theory. Maybe VF Disease was founded by someone who had heard of the VF Department, but didn't know much about it.
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Post by Foxy on Apr 17, 2019 9:14:35 GMT -5
(Curious that designer Alison Donalty got in but Handler's long-time editor, Sue Rich, didn't; but then again her name has so many fewer letters.) Since we're in THH, incidentally, people also tried to mine "pietrisycamollaviadelrechiotemexity" for anagrams, to the point where I no longer have to look up that utterance's spelling. 1) Hahaha to having pietrisycamollaviadelrechiotemexity memorized! 2) Her name is much shorter. I have only come up with "Eric Suh," but there is already an "Eriq" on the list. How long are the Baudelaires at the store? It still seems to be fairly early when they leave, probably not later than eight or nine, so it's not really surprising Poe wouldn't be at his office to reply to the telegraph. Also, Eleanora told him telegrams were dangerous. And she is probably locked in a damp basement at this point.
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Post by Uncle Algernon on Apr 17, 2019 17:37:32 GMT -5
2) Her name is much shorter. I have only come up with "Eric Suh," but there is already an "Eriq" on the list. Eir Such? Eir Cush? Yes, “Eir” is a first name, and one quite fitting to a "kind" person.
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Post by Carrie E. Abelabudite on Apr 17, 2019 19:03:36 GMT -5
Also, Eleanora told him telegrams were dangerous. And she is probably locked in a damp basement at this point. Right, but I still find it a little strange that the Baudelaires were so surprised Poe didn't reply to their telegram. They had no way of knowing about Eleanora, of course, but I don't see why they should have expected him to be at his office that early in the morning in any case. Chapter FourDid Lemony ask a dentist to hollow out his tooth to smuggle a page of his book on to a plane? That seems like a very difficult and painful process - is there really no other way he could have brought it with him? Why is this page so contentious, anyway? Maybe he's worried about VFD's reaction, if he's exposing their secrets? Children should be seen and not heard, so adults should be heard and not seen, is probably my favourite piece of Snicketverse-adult absurd logic. '"this is just an antechamber, a small room I'm using to store my fruit. If you get hungry during the day, you may help yourself to something out of that bowl."' You'd think the hospital would provide the volunteers with lunch if they were there all day. Or maybe they do, and Hal is just saying they can eat the fruit in addition to this. I hope he has water too - the Baudelaires must still be very thirsty. Why does the hospital get so much information? Considering the number of files that don't seem to be related to medical matters, it seems the hospital is a VFD safe place of sorts. I think this is supported by TUA - that's probably why it's been so drummed into Hal that he's not to read any of the files, seeing as he's not yet a member. '"Somehow, I knew you three children were from the same family."' Wouldn't this be sort of obvious? 'after nine months, six days, and fourteen hours of research,' Clearly, Lemony has spent a long time gathering information, and is writing at least this part of the book quite some time after the events. '"there was some information about you in the file about the Snicket fires."' Later, this is called the Snicket File by everyone, but it seems very different here - certainly not like a file that had been written by the Snickets. It's possible Handler intended this to be a file detailing the fires Lemony was accused of setting, and was either meant to exonerate or incriminate him. Indeed, this isn't far off the mark from what we eventually learn the file contains, but the focus doesn't seem quite the same. Chapter Five
'If I had been with the children, I would have been able to tell them a long and terrible story about men and women who joined a noble organization only to find their lives wrecked by a greedy man and a lazy newspaper,' This description of VFD sounds very different to the way Lemony describes it in TEE. I suppose Lemony thinks VFD has been wrecked by the newspaper due to the Secret Organisations You Should Know About column, since they had to move headquarters a lot due to that. More personally, of course, TDP ruined Lemony's life by printing stories about fires he had supposedly set, but that can't be seen as VFD being ruined as a whole - really the only person whose life would have been wrecked by that is him, Lemony, and possibly Beatrice to a degree. I guess this is Handler planting the first seeds of what will later be known as the schism, though it changes a lot even between now and TCC. Here, it seems like it happened recently and Olaf was entirely to blame, with a bit of help from TDP. Is there any way to reconcile this with what we eventually find out? I guess we could say that Lemony is referring to a sub-schism rather than The Schism that happened when he was a child - since the word 'schism' isn't actually used, there's nothing to contradict this. It's possible he's thinking about the sad state of his life now and therefore looking back at his past in VFD in an overly romanticised way. He wants everything wrong with the organisation to be simple; to be entirely Olaf's fault, and, though he knows it isn't so, he is pretending to himself that that was how it happened while he still can. How do the Baudelaires not guess the meaning of 'Ana Gram'? The first time I read this book, I think this was the point where I figured out who really wrote The Marvellous Marriage. I guess that's why Handler wrote it like this, so the readers - in particular children - get to do some sleuthing of their own. 'The word "Beatrice" reminds me of a volunteer organization that was swarming with corruption,' This seems completely different to VFD as mentioned earlier in the chapter - here we see that it's not just Olaf who's causing problems. 'the word "midnight" reminds me that I must keep writing this chapter very quickly, or else I will probably drown." This is confusing - is Lemony is at a beach, in a place where he won't be able to reach the shore at high tide? Maybe he's just worried about being kidnapped and locked in an Italian restaurant again. Either way, even if he's managed to escape captivity, he's far from being out of the woods. At least the Baudelaires manga to get some sleep here, though it doesn't appear to be very much. Sunny thinks the file might be filed under 'Baudelaire', but she finds it empty. However, don't they find it under 'Baudelaire' later? Maybe Hal moved it, or else Sunny isn't sure where in the 'B' aisle 'Baudelaire' should be. What was Hal going to say before he got cut off? I don't think Olaf actually can know the Bauds are here at this point.
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Post by Dante on Apr 18, 2019 3:31:45 GMT -5
Sunny thinks the file might be filed under 'Baudelaire', but she finds it empty. However, don't they find it under 'Baudelaire' later? Maybe Hal moved it, or else Sunny isn't sure where in the 'B' aisle 'Baudelaire' should be. Foxy has raised this issue before, and I came to the conclusion that this was Sunny's mistake, not Handler's.
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Post by Foxy on Apr 18, 2019 9:04:59 GMT -5
Also, Eleanora told him telegrams were dangerous. And she is probably locked in a damp basement at this point. Right, but I still find it a little strange that the Baudelaires were so surprised Poe didn't reply to their telegram. They had no way of knowing about Eleanora, of course, but I don't see why they should have expected him to be at his office that early in the morning in any case. Another solution I thought of is perhaps they were in a different time zone? If a prominent member of your fire-putting-out-centered group is supposedly starting fires, that can really harm the reputation of the entire group. Sunny thinks the file might be filed under 'Baudelaire', but she finds it empty. However, don't they find it under 'Baudelaire' later? Maybe Hal moved it, or else Sunny isn't sure where in the 'B' aisle 'Baudelaire' should be. Foxy has raised this issue before, and I came to the conclusion that this was Sunny's mistake, not Handler's. I also came to a conclusion about what Sunny was really doing in the "B" aisle in The Sunny Baudelaire Diaries
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Post by Carrie E. Abelabudite on Apr 18, 2019 16:02:38 GMT -5
Another solution I thought of is perhaps they were in a different time zone? Yeah, that might work. It could also be a way to solve the characters essentially skipping a day in TGG - you could argue they crossed the date line. Still, that brings into question how far away everything is in relation to other places. I get the sense the Baudelaires are never really that far from the city, but if they live near a time zone border, it's possible they're crossing back and forth. I see what you mean, but I think that would have been a bigger issue in the original schism, whereas VFD probably already had a reputation for fire-starting by the time Olaf embarked upon his career of arson. Still, maybe previous arsonists kept their actions under wraps in a way Olaf did not. Chapter Six
I love the way Lemony's anecdotes about his own life start out seeming random and just for comedic purposes, and then they become an important part of the story. This has been building up for a while, but it's really noticeable here. Odd that Lemony should hide his books so no one would read them, when he also seems to want the world to know the Baudelaire story. I think I might have said this before, but it appears that he wants people to know what happened while also not wanting them to be burdened with the weight of the truth, hence his contradictory behaviour. 'Was it absolutely necessary to steal that sugar bowl from Esmé Squalor?' The first mention of the sugar bowl, although there's no indication here that it will become important the way it does later. Also, now the first-time reader would be able to figure out what it was Esme accused Beatrice of stealing, although now we also know that it was Lemony who did it. Still, the way the crime is talked about leads me to think that it was a collaborative effort on Beatrice and Lemony's part, even if Lemony was the one who physically took the bowl, which is why Esme blames Beatrice for stealing it. Stealing the keys from Hal is definitely the least justifiable thing the Baudelaires have done so far. Anything morally ambiguous they did before this book seemed necessary as a way to escape Olaf, whereas they don't actually need to read the file. Fittingly, they feel guiltier about it than anything else they have done. The way Hal talks makes it seem like glasses are sort of a rare commodity in the Snicketverse. Unless his have been made from some particularly expensive material. Didn't the Baudelaries lock the antechamber? How did Esme get in so easily? I think 'fin de siècle' specifically refers to the end of the nineteenth century. Are the Sinister Duo the 'official investigators? As judges, they could probably gain access to these files quite easily. '"That's why you should keep paper clips on papers that belong together," Klaus said, "even when you file them."' A volunteer would know this; a page getting left behind should be a sign that it was taken by someone villainous, though a first-time reader wouldn't know enough about VFD to guess this just yet. 'there was just one photograph stapled into place, below one sentence of type.' As has been pointed out before, the location of the sentence in relation to the photo changes a lot. If the writing is above the photo, it sounds like it could be referring to people other than the ones who are in the picture. It seems really improbable that Lemony would be able to obscure his face in a photo when he was standing in between two people whose faces are not obscured. I think it makes the most sense to assume the photo was taken when Lemony and Beatrice were a couple - Beatrice is standing between Lemony and Bertrand, so the children think of their parents as being 'together', but then they don't know about Beatrice's relationship with Lemony. This might cause timeline issues, though, since it makes the most sense to assume this was taken when 667 Dark Avenue was used as a VFD HQ/Safe Place, but I think TUA implies they only would have moved there after Lemony and Beatrice's break up. Or not. It's hard to figure out when the Building Committee meeting transcript is meant to have taken place, but that's true of everything in TUA. Chapter Seven
'Ed' isn't the most obvious nickname for Thomas Alva Edison. The lyrics to The Butcher Boy are pretty creepy, but then so are a lot of folk songs/nursery rhymes people sing to kids. '[Esme] was carrying a handbag shaped like an eye, just like the tattoo her boyfriend had on his left ankle.' As with Dr Orwell's office, I don't see how this could display the VFD insignia. The first time I read this book, I'd never heard the term 'stiletto heel'. Every time I hear the phrase, I think of Esme. Interesting that Esme refers to the file as 'the Baudelaire file'. The illustration in the middle of the chapter looks kind of strange - Violet's arms bend at an unnatural angle. '"Did you read the file?" she demanded in a terrible voice. "What does the file say?"' It seems like at this point, Olaf and Esme don't know what's in the file, and simply want to destroy it as a precaution. Later on, they seem to know the gist of what's in it, even if they don't know whether or not there's really a survivor. Odd that Klaus could make it through the chute, but Violet couldn't fit. You wouldn't think that she could be so much bigger. Another sleepless night for Klaus and Sunny at least, although they did sleep, albeit badly, the night before.
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