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Post by gothicarchiesfan on Jun 16, 2020 19:54:41 GMT -5
Is there a VFD manhole cover on the street in front of Olaf’s house? Yup. I think it's actually seen in the trailer.
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Post by gothicarchiesfan on Jun 18, 2020 13:47:04 GMT -5
Out of all the new cast members, the one I was most unsure of was K. Todd Freeman because I had never seen him in anything before. But his version of Mr Poe ended up being one of my favourite characters on the show.
I remember reading in an interview that his take was that if ignorance is bliss, then Mr Poe should actually be one of the happiest and self-satisfied people in the entire cast rather than just a stuffy stick in the mud. It's an unusual interpretation but it really worked for me.
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Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Jun 18, 2020 14:26:54 GMT -5
I want to point out that putting Eleanora Poe as Mr. Poe's wife. The actress who played her, Cleo King played very well. The couple's chemistry is strangely realistic, I don't know how to say it any other way. They seem to have been really married for years, and still seem to love each other. Putting Eleanora right here, helped to understand her better as a character, besides being able to eliminate Geraldine Juliene. It didn't bother me at all. Seeing the Poe couple's chemistry made up for any change. I also have to say that I was very happy that she was a fat black actress that didn't get a highlight. I'm black and I've been fat. And I don't like it at all when TV shows put an actor like that and as they say to the audience: "Look how cool we are, we put a black guy or a fat guy for an important role". I find this so revolting! But it didn't happen here, at any time.
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Post by Dante on Jun 18, 2020 14:47:31 GMT -5
I raised my eyebrows, on a conceptual level, at the idea of conflating Polly Poe and Eleanora Poe - but actually it was a tremendously elegant choice, bringing some of the later themes and subplots forward to the early series in a natural way whilst also allowing for a great deal more humour now that the Eleanora character is closer to the action. In canon, Polly Poe barely exists - she has exactly one, extremely generic line; and without the Eleanora/Geraldine subplot from the U.A. ever really going anywhere, there was a good case for combining that pair, too. So I was quickly quite impressed with this change, which achieved more than simple character economy.
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Post by gothicarchiesfan on Jun 18, 2020 15:17:38 GMT -5
I raised my eyebrows, on a conceptual level, at the idea of conflating Polly Poe and Eleanora Poe - but actually it was a tremendously elegant choice, bringing some of the later themes and subplots forward to the early series in a natural way whilst also allowing for a great deal more humour now that the Eleanora character is closer to the action. In canon, Polly Poe barely exists - she has exactly one, extremely generic line; and without the Eleanora/Geraldine subplot from the U.A. ever really going anywhere, there was a good case for combining that pair, too. So I was quickly quite impressed with this change, which achieved more than simple character economy. Poor Polly Poe. She ended up being adapted out of the show and having all her lines of dialogue and closeups cut out of the movie.
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Post by Dante on Jun 19, 2020 10:30:59 GMT -5
I am genuinely surprised to learn that she was ever in the movie at all.
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Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Jun 19, 2020 13:25:42 GMT -5
I liked Jacquelin. I didn't like being told she was R. That was pointless. But a VFD agent totally invisible and never mentioned in the books would make more sense. After all, the world doesn't revolve around the Baudelaires. That was the idea that the writers had in the first season. Not all scenes shown are actually narrated by Lemony Snicket. This is an important detail to understand the series. Lemony is telling the story of the Baudelaires. But the series is showing more than that. I think that is a good concept. The first time I watched it I found it very strange, but then I liked it. Regarding the use of spyglass / spyglass I believe that this was imported from the film due to a need to close the arc of the film. Many were curious to understand what that spyglass was after all. And I think the writers saw an opportunity to bring in curious people from the film who had never read the book to watch the series. The fact that the spyglass would have stood out was pretty obvious since the TV series promotional images. I can say that it doesn't bother me anymore.
Something I really, really, really, really liked, was that they filled Klaus with personality. In the books, Klaus and Violet have the same personality, differentiated only by their abilities (and even this is confusing in TMM). That's why I love Sunny so much. In books, she stands out among the brothers. But on the show, Klaus is much more irritable, and I feel that if he were alone this story would be very different. Violet is like an anchor for Klaus's impetuosity, and Klaus is like an engine for Violet's patience. I don't know how far the writers planned this, but the director of episode 2 managed to make that very clear. Their difference since episode 2 matches the differences of opinion that perhaps led to the VFD Schism. Is it better to seek total peace in the face of evil, or should fire be fought with fire? I find it very convenient that this has been shown since the beginning of the series (if it was intentional the director is to be congratulated for subtly demonstrating this and ensuring that the experience of watching again is really pleasant, and not just finding a lot of references).
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Post by gothicarchiesfan on Jun 19, 2020 13:49:44 GMT -5
I liked Jacquelin. I didn't like being told she was R. That was pointless. But a VFD agent totally invisible and never mentioned in the books would make more sense. After all, the world doesn't revolve around the Baudelaires. That was the idea that the writers had in the first season. Not all scenes shown are actually narrated by Lemony Snicket. This is an important detail to understand the series. Lemony is telling the story of the Baudelaires. But the series is showing more than that. I think that is a good concept. The first time I watched it I found it very strange, but then I liked it. Regarding the use of spyglass / spyglass I believe that this was imported from the film due to a need to close the arc of the film. Many were curious to understand what that spyglass was after all. And I think the writers saw an opportunity to bring in curious people from the film who had never read the book to watch the series. The fact that the spyglass would have stood out was pretty obvious since the TV series promotional images. I can say that it doesn't bother me anymore. The spyglasses were actually a part of Daniel Handler's original script for the film, dating back all the way to at 2002. Since he was one of the writers for the show it makes sense that he would bring them back. As for Jacquelyn, I don't think she was originally meant to be the Duchess of Winnipeg, not in the first season at least. I get the feeling that after the writers learned she wouldn't be coming back for season 3, the hastily wrote that in as an explanation/nice bit of fan service.
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Post by gothicarchiesfan on Jun 19, 2020 14:11:23 GMT -5
I am genuinely surprised to learn that she was ever in the movie at all. So was I at first. But I when I saw her name in the end credits I checked the movie and she was in there, sort of. It's clear that at one point she and Mr Poe were going to be giving back and forth commentary on the Marvelous Marriage along with the critic and the cop, but those lines were entirely dropped. I imagine because the sequence was already running long and at the end of the day, Dustin Hoffman and Cedric the Entertainer were far more famous.
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Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Jun 19, 2020 14:34:28 GMT -5
I didn't like the scene of Sunny playing poker at all.
I really liked the closing. I didn't understand the reference to the Molotov cocktail, but this is suggested by Violet to try to escape the tower (in the books, not in the series). You can imagine Daniel Handler and others having fun inserting this here, as a Red hearing to indicate to readers that that couple was actually Mrs. B. This Red Hearing would be even more phenomenal if it were a weekly episode release, instead of allowing us do marathons.
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Post by Dante on Jun 19, 2020 15:03:06 GMT -5
Something I really, really, really, really liked, was that they filled Klaus with personality. In the books, Klaus and Violet have the same personality, differentiated only by their abilities (and even this is confusing in TMM). That's why I love Sunny so much. In books, she stands out among the brothers. But on the show, Klaus is much more irritable, and I feel that if he were alone this story would be very different. Violet is like an anchor for Klaus's impetuosity, and Klaus is like an engine for Violet's patience. There is a little of this in the early books. But it fades very quickly. I am genuinely surprised to learn that she was ever in the movie at all. So was I at first. But I when I saw her name in the end credits I checked the movie and she was in there, sort of. It's clear that at one point she and Mr Poe were going to be giving back and forth commentary on the Marvelous Marriage along with the critic and the cop, but those lines were entirely dropped. I imagine because the sequence was already running long and at the end of the day, Dustin Hoffman and Cedric the Entertainer were far more famous. Oh, that's interesting. Seeing the photos you posted, I have this vague idea that I had noticed that woman in my viewings of the film, and was vaguely aware that she seemed unusually visible for a background character. How ironic; she only needed two lines to have more lines than the original Polly Poe. This Red Hearing would be even more phenomenal if it were a weekly episode release, instead of allowing us do marathons. It would have been a lot of fun for the show to have been aired weekly. The discussion scene would have been so much richer.
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Post by gothicarchiesfan on Jun 19, 2020 15:50:54 GMT -5
Oh, that's interesting. Seeing the photos you posted, I have this vague idea that I had noticed that woman in my viewings of the film, and was vaguely aware that she seemed unusually visible for a background character. How ironic; she only needed two lines to have more lines than the original Polly Poe. Look on the bright side though, at least she was credited right above a character who didn't even appear in the movie, lol. :Edit: It's mind boggling just how much footage was cut out of this movie. One of the reasons the production dragged out for so long was because Carrey and the executives kept coming up with new ideas for scenes, thus extending the production further and further. This wasn't helped by the fact that Carrey often wouldn't show up to set which meant that many new scenes and bits of dialogue had to be added just to give the cast and crew something to do. The original cut was so bloated that the Marvelous Marriage sequence ran for about 20 minutes before they ever even got to the wedding. Maybe when we get to the movie, I'll try and compile a list of all the deleted/alternate scenes we know about. There's at least a good hour or so of material.
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Post by gothicarchiesfan on Jun 19, 2020 16:00:55 GMT -5
This Red Hearing would be even more phenomenal if it were a weekly episode release, instead of allowing us do marathons. Absolutely. I always think the biggest trouble with Netflix's binge-watching model is that basically kills any momentum for a show. If they had done it weekly we could have had at least two months of time for the hype to build.
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Post by Marlowe on Jun 19, 2020 16:31:47 GMT -5
Look on the bright side though, at least she was credited right above a character who didn't even appear in the movie, lol. God, it still annoys me to this day that Silberling made such inspired casting choices like Timothy Spall, Jane Adams, Jennifer Coolidge, Luis Guzman, and Craig Ferguson - only to do absolutely nothing interesting with any of them.
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Post by Hermes on Jun 19, 2020 16:53:39 GMT -5
It's worth remembering that the only mention of Eleonora in the main series relates to the Baudelaires meeting her at the Hotel Preludio, as reported in TPP, and there we don't hear either her surname or her occupation. The whole saga of Eleonora Poe, the editor, comes entirely from TUA.
And there is a mention of a spyglass in TSS, so it is book canon, even though it was movie canon first.
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