|
|
Post by smileyman457 on Oct 25, 2006 16:32:37 GMT -5
Alright, if Kit was dead by the time Snicket wrote ASoUE, what 'sister' was he writing to in The Grim Grotto? Could it have not been to her at the time, but a letter he hid just for the readers to know more? Or did she survive? Or did Handler just slip-up in his plot hole repair?
|
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Oct 26, 2006 3:21:28 GMT -5
Did he not write to Kit in TCC and TSS, not TGG?
Possibilities: He didn't know Kit was dead, or he's writing each book not long after it happens, so when he wrote those letters Kit was still alive. This doesn't give him much time to write some of the later books, which are only about a day or two in duration, but Jerome had little more than a week to write Odious Lusting After Finance, and he managed it. It's been proposed that - in the aSoUE setting - Lemony's books are released early to V.F.D. and that the editions we're reading are fully edited versions published later.
|
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Oct 27, 2006 6:19:19 GMT -5
Kit directly refers to Jacques as her brother in Chapter Two of TPP; she'd have to have lied, and it would confuse her love life yet more.
Edit: And Captain Widdershins refers to Jacques and Kit as siblings in TGG, but that's just picking holes in the husband-wife possibility. However, nobody ever manages to mention Lemony's name to the Baudelaires, so you could build some theories around Jacques and Kit not being his siblings, although I wouldn't personally.
|
|
|
|
Post by Jacques the Environmentalist on Dec 1, 2006 23:02:20 GMT -5
How'd Jerome only have a week to write Odious Lusting After Finance? We don't know how much time elapsed between tee and tvv.
And that confused me too. And I know there was a bit in tgg about him trying to find a crouton to save Kit.
Aha.
"as I, between paragraphs, am picking through this salad in front of me, hoping that my waiter is more noble than wicked, and that my sister, Kit, might be saved by the small, herbed piece of toast I hope to retrieve from my bowl."- tgg pgs 225-226
How on Earth does that work? There were definitely no waiters on the island. Was Kit in mortal danger at some point shortly before she went off to sea?
|
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Dec 2, 2006 3:52:37 GMT -5
How'd Jerome only have a week to write Odious Lusting After Finance? We don't know how much time elapsed between tee and tvv. True, but Jerome says in TPP (p193) that he only started searching for the Baudelaires after hearing what happened to them in the Village of Fowl Devotees, and on page 194 he says: "Wherever I looked for you, Baudelaires, I found selfish plots to steal your fortune. I read books on injustice in all the libraries you left behind and eventually wrote a book myself." The order he phrases that sentence in indicates that he didn't start reading books from these libraries they left behind until he'd started his search for the Baudelaires, and therefore he started his book during TVV at the earliest (and probably somewhat later, if he visited multiple libraries they left behind, although most were destroyed, so he could have been referring to libraries they'd visited prior to TVV - but he still didn't visit them until after the Baudelaires' imprisonment). In addition, we can probably make a good guess as to how much time passes between TEE and TVV - the Baudelaires start it reading a report on the end of TEE in the morning edition of The Daily Punctilio, which reports it as new news. While it's hardly the most accurate newspaper, it's usually supernaturally quick on picking things up, so I don't think it's going to be more than a week, and Mr. Poe sends the Baudelaires off to V.F.D. the same day. Yeah, that's why I'd dismiss it as another random anecdote of no significance. It can probably fit between events, or possibly Lemony had been misinformed about some peril Kit wasn't actually in, or it was part of some other event that happened offscreen that we have far too few details about to understand. |
|
|
|
Post by Dear Dairy on Dec 2, 2006 9:23:20 GMT -5
Perhaps during the writing of TGG they were having lunch, and Kit commented: "You know, Lemmie, I'm dying for a crouton!"
Or perhaps, being aware of the possibility that Medusoid Mycelium could be released later at the Hotel Denoument, he searched for a garlicky crouton to wrap up and take with him to meet her there, just in case it was needed.
|
|
|
|
Post by Jacques the Environmentalist on Dec 4, 2006 22:15:48 GMT -5
Hm. It still doesn't make sense but ok.
Handler enjoys having his characters do stuff amazingly quickly. It'd never work if he weren't such an amazing writer. I'm in creative writing and we're not allowed to do stuff like that.
|
|
|
|
Post by Jacques the Environmentalist on Dec 5, 2006 21:18:23 GMT -5
Well it is creative you just have to follow some set rules. Which is annoying. But back on topic.
Do you think Lemony and Kit did successfully get a room at Hotel denouement? Could Kit have come to fetch the baudelaires from the hotel? Or did Lemony show up after Kit had already left to go find Widdershins? I'm thinking the latter.
|
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Dec 6, 2006 13:05:57 GMT -5
I think I once heard it suggested that, if Lemony was indeed Justice Strauss's taxi-driver (and it was apparently her taxi following the Baudelaires and Kit in Chapter One), then Kit and Lemony could have met directly after Chapter Two. It doesn't sound to me like Kit would have had the time, with the things she was doing, to go back to the hotel after that; she'd only have had Tuesday afternoon and the following night until very early Wednesday to be there without having found out about Dewey's death (and she was unaware of it in The End). I get the impression she was rather busy at sea. In fact, here's a quote from The End that suggests she never returned to the hotel after leaving the area in Chapter Two:
"We were watching the skies. We saw the smoke and we knew you were signaling us that it wasn't safe to join you."
Page 168
|
|
|
|
Post by Jacques the Environmentalist on Dec 7, 2006 22:33:16 GMT -5
Indeed. But I just can't forget that whole savior crouton bit.
Hmmm.
|
|
Sonatone
Reptile Researcher
... Wha? Can you say that again?
Posts: 30
Likes: 1
|
Post by Sonatone on Feb 10, 2007 11:16:52 GMT -5
Right. Theory-that-doesn't-really-make-sense time.
ASoUE was written when it was going on. So when things in Book 13th was happening, he was writing earlier books, possibly TSS/TGG/TCC/Whicheverbookitwas. So possibly, either Kit was still alive when he wrote that, or the news hadn't reached him yet (Since no-one else (alive) knew of Kit's death except for the Bauds, and they didn't leave the island until one year after her death).
Sure, it takes a long time for him to research and everything, but maybe that's why he wrote the letter nearing the end of the series, instead of at the beggining.
When he said that his tragedy ended long before the Bauds' started, it could've referred to Beatrice thinking him dead and marrying Bertrand instead of Beatrice dying. Possible.
|
|
littlemiss
Reptile Researcher
Thie world is quiet here.
Posts: 26 
|
Post by littlemiss on Oct 25, 2008 13:32:07 GMT -5
i thought it was that they thought he was dead.
"If it is a girl we will name her violet, if it is a boy we will name him lemony" written by the badelaire parents
i thought they thought he was dead because they name babies after dead people
so there was a dead violet klaus and sunny before the baudelaires?
why isn't klaus named lemony since violet was a girl if lemony was a possible name.
anyway thats why i think all of them thought lemony snicket was dead but beatrice baudelaire knew he was alive?
|
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Oct 25, 2008 15:54:07 GMT -5
i thought it was that they thought he was dead. "If it is a girl we will name her violet, if it is a boy we will name him lemony" written by the badelaire parents i thought they thought he was dead because they name babies after dead people so there was a dead violet klaus and sunny before the baudelaires? why isn't klaus named lemony since violet was a girl if lemony was a possible name. anyway thats why i think all of them thought lemony snicket was dead but beatrice baudelaire knew he was alive? I assume that, when the Baudelaires returned to the mainland, Beatrice received the telegram that is LS to BB #6 in The Beatrice Letters - confirming to the couple that Lemony is, in fact, still alive, when they had earlier thought him dead. Hence Klaus isn't named after him. It's fairly concrete that Beatrice refused to marry Lemony because she falsely believed he was guilty of certain crimes, though. |
|
