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Post by ryantrimble457 on Jan 12, 2017 21:11:50 GMT -5
Discuss the series as a whole. Spoilers may remain free and untagged. This is the wild wild west, y'all.
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Post by ironic impostor on Jan 13, 2017 10:20:00 GMT -5
Just finished the first season. It's really, really good, or at least I thought so. That's all I've got to say at the moment, but after I get some sleep and can more properly form thoughts that are actually worth something, I'll hop back on and see if anyone else has contributed anything.
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WicCaesar
Reptile Researcher
Sereno.
Posts: 19
Likes: 13
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Post by WicCaesar on Jan 13, 2017 12:36:06 GMT -5
So it was Esmé who burned the Quagmire mansion! If it was in the books I had totally forgotten and it was so exciting to see it happening in front of my eyes!
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Post by A comet crashing into Earth on Jan 13, 2017 16:36:29 GMT -5
What I liked most, I find, is actually the references to ATWQ. When I first heard "When did you see her last?", I got so excited and immediately explained its significance to the people around me. "Get scared later" took this to another level - the first thing was pretty much just a writer (DH?) inserting a stealthy reference, but this is a new piece of continuity tying the two stories together. Presumably, Beatrice learned the mantra from Lemony. The Qwerty quote in ep. 7 seemed in my eyes to open up the possibility that this show will also aim to explain or use elements from ATWQ, possibly laying the ground work for a follow-up show after season 3. "If there's no one up there..." was also nice. I think my excitement with these details is that they were not only good, but unexpected.
I assumed from the end of the first episode that Mother and Father were who they turned out to be, but it was still a relief to me when that was confirmed. If they'd been who they were implied to be, I'd have a hard time imagining how that wouldn't have turned the story in an aberrant direction. Of course, that relief was mixed with a certain pity, knowing that what was being set up as their parents behind the Very Fancy Door was actually just Count Olaf in disguise - again. Either way, a very satisfying emotional response, even if I very strongly suspected all along that this was going to happen. Sometimes it's most satisfying just to see the story you've already figured out play out. Speaking of which: Now that the viewers have had their red herring hint at surviving Baudelaire parents, I wonder whether the children will still have theirs in the later books, and how that would work. Somehow they would probably have to signal to the viewers that the parents weren't actually alive, otherwise it would just seem repetitive.
I was wondering about their decision to end the first season at TMM - the book is commonly considered the weakest one in the series, and it only allowed them to film one book that didn't already have an adaptation sitting in the public's consciousness. Having seen this, however, it was perfect. The Quagmire fire is a great bookend to the Baudelaire fire, and seeing Duncan & Isadora at the end, without the Baudelaires doing so, also had a good effect - knowing what importance they would go on to have for the Baudelaires, of course, but also imagining what effect it must have on people who haven't read the books. Also, because this is the story that needed to change the most in order to work as a screen adaptation, the decision to end the season there resulted in fans of the books ending the season on a plot they didn't already know.
Prufrock Prep looked exactly like I imagined it (from the outside, not at all from the inside, though that looks great too). I am so satisfied with that, and so looking forward to seeing the next two episodes taking place there (though to be fair, every book from this point takes place in a setting that I'm inordinately excited to see brought to the screen).
I notice that the dubious characters are generally made more likable. The troupe express their joy over the children's cooking, is horrified to see Olaf lifting Sunny, and HoIG (who is, by the way, by far an improvement from the book - his profound moments are brilliant, and much, much better representation for non-binaries, at least as far as I can judge) is afraid of seeing Monty's corpse. Josephine is redeemed from her worst flaw, attempting to sell out the children to Count Olaf, and is even given a past that makes her a much more glamorous character (which of course makes it easier to forgive her shortcomings). Even her cowardice, a defining trait in the book, is eventually cured in the show as she stands up to Count Olaf, most likely knowing the position she was in. And Sir is... well, he's still horrible, really, but he was more polite to the Baudelaires than the average adult during their introduction, even though he was probably one of those who had least social obligation to, what with them trespassing and all. Besides, seeing Charles care so much for him in spite of everything does awaken a spark of sympathy.
...which brings us to his and Charles' partnership. I'm satisfied with it being almost certainly confirmed to be the kind of partnership we all knew it was, and with neither of them being played particularly effiminately. That's pretty much what I have to say, and it's not a new opinion, but it's the kind of thing that creators should get positive feedback for.
The Beatrice dedications were great. My only complaint is that by the time we got to the fourth, I'd told my family that it would have a good one, and then half of it was cut (I wonder why, maybe Emma Montana McElroy didn't want to be involved).
I'm not the biggest fan of the poker game. It seems out of place, and even if it were stylistically appropriate, it seems too easy a way for Sunny to get down from the tower. That's outweighed by getting a reference to Fernald's deck of cards so early on.
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Post by nyksnicket on Jan 13, 2017 23:16:59 GMT -5
This series was everything I hoped for and so so much more! The mother & Father skits I thought for sure it was the Baudelaire's but it was surprising and rather nice to know it wasn't and was the Quagmire's. That was a great twist that helped make a cliffhanger till Season 2!
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Post by Strangely on Jan 14, 2017 0:45:17 GMT -5
I'm very impressed with this series overall. That ending was awesome, really brought everything together. The musical number was a nice touch too, it just seemed like the perfect note to go out on.
It's interesting Prufrock Prep got so much time, clearly they wanted to work a season two set into season ones budget. Felt very Hogwarts, almost like they were making a joke.
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Post by Vibrant Faux Duck on Jan 14, 2017 0:56:36 GMT -5
I was up until 4:30 AM watching the first three episodes (they went online at 2:00 AM local time) and finished the last five today. I'll admit that I was completely thrown by the parents' red herring. I thought for sure that we would watch Beatrice and Bertrand continuously just miss reuniting with their children until their unfortunate death in the series finale (presumably involving a leaky submarine). It still didn't click when the Quagmire triplets were first shown being served pancakes that they were their parents.
The sub-plot with Jacquelyn and Gustav is new, but I do like it. If I recall correctly, there wasn't much talk about VFD or the secrets during these first few books, so it helps bring the mystery element into the series.
Plotwise, I think the series was perfect and stayed fairly true to the books, aside from the changed to TMM which I think helped move the story along.
Now that I've seen this glimpse of Esme, all I can picture is Lady Gaga's Countess character from American Horror Story.
Were there movie still of Zomies in the Snow in the autobiography? I feel like I have seen that exact set before.
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Post by Reba on Jan 14, 2017 2:49:28 GMT -5
good things about the show:
- eleanora poe - uncle monty - sunny's facial expressions - captain sham's sailor song - the baudelaires sneaking off to lucky smells
bad things about the show:
- literally everything and everyone else (yes, including the dumbassed "literally" jokes)
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Post by ryantrimble457 on Jan 14, 2017 3:19:06 GMT -5
First off, let me say that everything was perfect and I have non complaints at all.
Secondly, I love that Prufrock looks like nega-Hogwarts on the inside. It's so beautiful. And the outside looked precisely like how I imagined. Like EVERYTHING looked perfect. But wow, the PPS set was INSANELY perfect.
I can't believe we have to wait another year. Holy God.
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Post by zinthaniel on Jan 14, 2017 3:37:15 GMT -5
I loved it. I will say that the Louis and Malina need to maybe take some acting coaching for season 2 and onward to better learn how to melt into their characters, but they held their own well enough.
Surprisingly Malina stole every scene from Louis who was the weakest of the two. The trailers gave the impression that Louis would outshine her.
I love Patrick as Lemony. Brilliant performance. Brilliant choices in his mannerism, cadence of voice, and overall melancholy.
NPH was great as well. Though I never seen anything he was in prior. So unlike, what seems to be the world, I didn't have any biases against him.
Special shout out to The White face Women and the henchmen of indeterminate gender - absolutely hilarious.
Overall I loved it, but I will say my second viewing is way better than my first.
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Post by Liam R. Findlay on Jan 14, 2017 10:00:56 GMT -5
Something that was enjoyable in the books was how background characters you thought little of turned out to be henchpeople at the end (like the white-faced women at the school) and it was enjoyable to guess who might turn out to be a hidden villain while reading. It was also enjoyable to experience them individually, finding our more about them and seeing them in action. It's nice that the troupe are more involved in the show, but I think it slightly takes from their 'time to shine'. Granted, they get some moments of individual action, but often with a crowd standing behind them. They're also less slippery and mysterious because they have a more obtrusive presence in a group. It feels like having four different puddings to eat over the week but mixing them all in a bowl and having them in one sitting instead, making it less appealing when you get served the same mixture every day, instead of a new, individual pudding.
That said, I liked seeing them more anyway and perhaps it was necessary to include them together more often to help fill up hour-long episodes with variety. They also still get some independent jobs (I liked the white-faced women at the cinema) which are enjoyable to see!
ALSO, I didn't consider that it might be Esmé at the mansion!!!!!!!!!!!!! That's exciting.
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Post by Strangely on Jan 14, 2017 11:22:30 GMT -5
Surprisingly Malina stole every scene from Louis who was the weakest of the two. The trailers gave the impression that Louis would outshine her. I agree. She has a very expressive face and managed to really give a subtle performance as Violet. She also did a decent job singing, even getting her own line in that song. It makes me happy that Violet got more of the spotlight, she is the oldest and leader of the trio after all. Credit to her for holding the baby nearly the entire time. Seriously, like 90% of the show. It's a good thing Sunny learns to walk next season. Louis was definitely weaker, but in fairness he also had some of the more difficult dialogue sequences, so there was a sharp learning curve, especially given his acting experience. Some line reads were a bit stiff, like he was reading directly out of the book. I think he got a lot better towards the end of the season, so I expect he'll stand out more in season two. It's his first big role and he did ok overall. It's easy to want to compare them against the child actors of Stranger Things, but that's not exactly fair for this particular sow. Violet and Klaus have the almost thankless task of playing straight against an entire adult cast who seemingly were having a scene chewing contest. Being the one's in charge of grounding the series is a tall order, so all things considered they really did pretty well.
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Post by zinthaniel on Jan 14, 2017 11:58:18 GMT -5
Surprisingly Malina stole every scene from Louis who was the weakest of the two. The trailers gave the impression that Louis would outshine her. I agree. She has a very expressive face and managed to really give a subtle performance as Violet. She also did a decent job singing, even getting her own line in that song. It makes me happy that Violet got more of the spotlight, she is the oldest and leader of the trio after all. Credit to her for holding the baby nearly the entire time. Seriously, like 90% of the show. It's a good thing Sunny learns to walk next season. Louis was definitely weaker, but in fairness he also had some of the more difficult dialogue sequences, so there was a sharp learning curve, especially given his acting experience. Some line reads were a bit stiff, like he was reading directly out of the book. I think he got a lot better towards the end of the season, so I expect he'll stand out more in season two. It's his first big role and he did ok overall. It's easy to want to compare them against the child actors of Stranger Things, but that's not exactly fair for this particular sow. Violet and Klaus have the almost thankless task of playing straight against an entire adult cast who seemingly were having a scene chewing contest. Being the one's in charge of grounding the series is a tall order, so all things considered they really did pretty well. I agree, I could definitely see Louis growing into his role as he got more comfortable. Both of them, because even though Malina was the MVP of the two even she faltered for me in some line delivery. But you're right this is a very advance script. The dialogue is very unnatural, which is necessary to stay true to the absurdest and zany spirit of the series, so I can see how it was hard for them to find an angle at such a young age to be able to delivery these very unnatural lines naturally.
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Post by Reba on Jan 14, 2017 13:45:19 GMT -5
If you think the show was primarily a negative adaptation, that's a unique take on this forum, and if you explained your series-wide reasoning and perspective on that I would find that read fascinating. It's just, well, you've got to work harder to convey your opinion if you thought that the show was bad - scattering single, sarcastic, sardonic sentences saying something someone scrutinizing Sonnenfeld's series savored was just plain "bad" is a cheap, wet blanket shot at something someone else enjoyed. Having a different opinion doesn't make you a killjoy, but only saying that you didn't like something immediately after someone else says they does, with no explanation except for personal taste, is unnecessarily cruel. Explaining why you didn't like something is fine, but as it is, it seems like you descended upon this part of the forum like a cloud a week before the show was released for the express purpose of being disagreeable and dampening others' enthusiasm. (Also, wait, the "literally" jokes were taken almost verbatim from the books - at least the Snicket parts. The continued use of the joke in the rest of the episode was new, but not in a different way than Snicket's aside in the book. I just don't understand how that was dumb, unless you also thought it was dumb in the books - but, again, I wouldn't understand until I heard an explanation. An explanation, even one I didn't agree with, would be understandable as a sincere expression of opinion.) yes, well, much like other people on this forum who have been lemony snicket fans their entire lives, and who also spent the entirety of yesterday binge watching, i was posting my immediate thoughts on each episode as i went along without too much heavy analysis. however, other people seemed to love the show, so they only posted contextless lists of scenes they apparently enjoyed, whereas the things that jumped out to me the most were things that i hated. i had serious doubts about the show before it came out, that's true, but everyone else was defending it tooth and nail from the negative reviews before they had even seen it; i've also, tbh, been a bit baffled with the responses that parts of the show have gotten from people whose judgment i otherwise respect, so i couldn't help but overplay the devil's advocate role a bit. still, i promise i didn't go into the show wanting to dislike it, and as far as i can tell i've already individually mentioned most things i disliked in the other threads. since i'm not a professional critic, it's not gonna get much more comprehensive than that, sorry. i'll just say that most of the grievances other people have mentioned before saying "but that's okay, i still loved it ya know" were actually glaringly obnoxious to me, and they piled up more and more with each episode to the point that they were not nitpicking, or one rough patch or whatever, but were basically just the fundamental atmosphere of the show.
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Post by gliquey on Jan 14, 2017 14:00:58 GMT -5
Overall, this series was outstanding. There are hundreds of places where the show deviates from the book, and I think almost all of them are in the spirit of the books' tone and style, even if some are not my cup of tea. I think NPH was absolutely perfect as Olaf, and even if he was a huge selling point for the series, I don't feel he was overshadowing the children as the stars of the show. Sunny, I feel, could have been given a few more important lines or contributed more to discussions with her siblings, rather than just being a form of comic relief who insults adults, but I was happy with her biting scenes and it's understandable that Netflix didn't choose to portray her as the strangely sentient being who understands much more than a baby should that we get in the books. Their repeated emphasis on the fact that she couldn't read in TMM was pushing it a bit though. I thought I'd have heard somebody complain about Warburton's portrayal of Snicket so far but I've been surprised. I very much like his take on Snicket but on the other hand I thought some people would take issue with his tone of voice and the speed he speaks at. I've been watching them for 8 episodes and I still don't know how I feel about the theater troupe, but I'm leaning towards disliking them. The hook-handed man is reasonable, but the others... having them all appear all at once means that, for instance, the bald man doesn't get a personality. And I just don't like the way the white-faced women look - they're completely different to how I've always pictured them, though I guess I can't really expect the costume department to read my mind. If only they had just stuck to the books and showed them one by one rather than all bundled together. Sometimes, less is more. Just finished the first season. It's really, really good, or at least I thought so. That's all I've got to say at the moment, but after I get some sleep and can more properly form thoughts that are actually worth something, I'll hop back on and see if anyone else has contributed anything. So if my calculations are right the first season is 390 minutes long and you submitted this post 440 minutes after it was released. You must have been one of the first people [not working on the show / reviewers] to have seen the whole of the first season. A dubious honour but I'm impressed. The Beatrice dedications were great. My only complaint is that by the time we got to the fourth, I'd told my family that it would have a good one, and then half of it was cut (I wonder why, maybe Emma Montana McElroy didn't want to be involved). I just mentioned this in another thread - I was outraged at not getting the last half of the dedication. I assumed they chose to cut it because they thought people would get bored watching a four line poem being slowly typed out; I think the TMM dedication is the longest one in the series. At least the first two lines make sense on their own, but it is a shame they omit the punchline. It's interesting Prufrock Prep got so much time, clearly they wanted to work a season two set into season ones budget. Felt very Hogwarts, almost like they were making a joke. I thought the Baudelaire's uniforms made them look very much like they were in Hogwarts, although I couldn't put my finger on why. I haven't even seen the movies for several years now (though I have read the books as many times as ASOUE). That budget point is an interesting one; I hadn't even considered that. I thought the Baudelaires sitting down on the bench, and the camera panning to reveal the Quagmires on the other side, would have been a good ending to the season, though it wasn't quite the final scene.
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