Luigi
Bewildered Beginner
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Post by Luigi on Feb 16, 2004 16:06:31 GMT -5
My two cents: Church and state should be seperate. Some people are anti-gay marriages because the bible is against it. But marriages are state issues, and the bible should not interfere with it. One's silly little beliefs should not ruin a group of people's life styles.
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Post by Madamluna on Feb 16, 2004 16:48:21 GMT -5
"The Kinsey Reports are two controversial books on human sexual behaviour, Sexual Behavior in the Human Male (1948) and Sexual Behavior in the Human Female (1953), by Dr. Alfred C. Kinsey and others. Kinsey was a zoologist at the Indiana University at Bloomington and the founder of the Institute for Sex Research.
Kinsey's research astounded the general public and was immediately controversial and sensational. He concluded among other things:
Something between 90% and 95% of people were somewhat bisexual (see Kinsey scale). frolicking in the fields was almost universal in human males. Women who reported frolicking in the fields before marriage had no less sexual satisfaction in their marriages, there was even a slight correlation of greater satisfaction. These findings caused shock and outrage, both because they challenged conventional beliefs about sexuality and because they discussed subjects that had previously been taboo. The belief that heterosexuality and abstinence were both ethical and statistical norms had never before been seriously challenged."
Found it at wordiq.com after Googling for "Dr. Kinsey's definition of homosexuality."
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Post by Mrs. (Alphonse) Elric on Feb 16, 2004 21:35:13 GMT -5
That's so sad. And to Pandora, I'm not going to argue with you about disagreeing. You are free to have your own beliefs, even if I think they are wrong. And to J, I'm not going to argue either, I just want to state my opinion. America's Constitution was based on the Bible, so not mixing religon and state is pretty much impossible. People's beliefs WILL interfear with others life styles, whether you like it or not.
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Post by BSam on Feb 16, 2004 23:07:55 GMT -5
That's so sad. And to Pandora, I'm not going to argue with you about disagreeing. You are free to have your own beliefs, even if I think they are wrong. And to J, I'm not going to argue either, I just want to state my opinion. America's Constitution was based on the Bible, so not mixing religon and state is pretty much impossible. People's beliefs WILL interfear with others life styles, whether you like it or not. i was looking through gaia threads for posts which say that it's NOT actually based on the bible...but they seem to have disapearred... ...hum..ignore me for now...
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Post by BSam on Feb 16, 2004 23:47:09 GMT -5
(thanks go gaia, i found what i'm looking for...) AMERICA WAS FOUNDED BY CHRISTIANS FOR RELIGIOUS FREEDOM -No. No, it wasn't. Brief history lesson: Opressed religious groups leave England, go over to the new world, set up shop. They're perfectly content to remain English citizens, they just wanted a place to go where they could practice religion in peace. And so it was all good. Until...unfair taxation! Let's go back to 7th grade. Does anyone remember that whole bit about the Stamp Act? The Declaratory Act? The Boston Tea Party? Paine's writing of Common Sense? Any of this ring a bell? The Declaration of Independence, the American Revolution, and the creation of the United States stemmed from economic causes. The founding fathers were clearly at least diests, they were spiritual men, this is clear from the wording of documents. However, they were not Christians. Thomas Jefferson wrote: "I have examined all the known superstitions of the world, and I do not find in our particular superstition of Christianity one redeeming feature. They are all alike founded on fables and mythology. Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned. What has been the effect of this coercion? To make one half the world fools and the other half hypocrites; to support roguery and error all over the earth. " John Adams wrote: "Where do we find a precept in the Bible for Creeds, Confessions, Doctrines and Oaths, and whole carloads of other trumpery that we find religion encumbered with in these days? " Thomas Paine wrote: "I would not dare to so dishonor my Creator God by attaching His name to that book (the Bible). Among the most detestable villains in history, you could not find one worse than Moses. Here is an order, attributed to 'God' to butcher the boys, to massacre the mothers and to debauch and rape the daughters. I would not dare so dishonor my Creator's name by (attaching) it to this filthy book (the Bible). It is the duty of every true Deist to vindicate the moral justice of God against the evils of the Bible. Accustom a people to believe that priests and clergy can forgive sins...and you will have sins in abundance. The Christian church has set up a religion of pomp and revenue in pretended imitation of a person (Jesus) who lived a life of poverty. " Treaty of Tripoli: Article 11 wrote: "As the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion,-as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion or tranquility of Musselmen,-and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries. " No one is saying that America isn't a largely Christian nation or that Christian values haven't had a strong influence on the development of America, on its history, and do not still continue to have a strong influence. However, America was not founded either by Christians or because of Christianity or a desire for religious freedom. That was only the formation of the colonies. The driving force behind independence was economics and the men responsible were spiritual men, but not Christians. This cites sources for quotes.More reading material if you care.whole post shamelessly stolen from here...
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Post by Mrs. (Alphonse) Elric on Feb 17, 2004 20:56:09 GMT -5
The US Consititution wasn't based on the Bible but the Bible was an influence. That's kinda what I meant...I probly shoulda fraised it differently...
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Post by BSam on Feb 18, 2004 0:05:12 GMT -5
That's kinda what I meant...I probly shoulda phrased it differently... fair enough... now...back to gay people...
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Post by timartwonis on Feb 23, 2004 22:22:08 GMT -5
if i were homophobic, one of my fave shows wouldnt be queer eye
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Post by Madamluna on Feb 24, 2004 14:22:09 GMT -5
I'm not a very political person, but to hear that Bush is backing an amendment to the Constitution banning gay marriage:
DEAR FUHRER: YOU ARE A DUMBASS.
Thank you. That is all.
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Post by Charles Vane on Feb 24, 2004 20:15:48 GMT -5
Just a warning to everyone, I'm probably going to swear in this post, but if you can't handle that you shouldn't be in Distrubing Discussion in the first place.
Ok can you tell me where you found this article? And why the hell he wants to do that? Is it just because he's a christian? Or does he find homosexuals 'icky'?
To the christian thing, this is my view with almost everything, if God doesn't force people to do things, nethier should any human being since they don't have more power than God. Ahhh why why why why why? This whole thing makes me wanna scream. I *hate* how any dumbass can go to Vegas or Cityhall and just get married for the hell of it as long as they are straight. I mean common example, Brittney Spears who was only married for what 55 hours? You can have no reason, no real love, but hey you're straight so go head get, married, then just get an annulment later. We have the highest divorce rate just because we don't respect marriage.
But now he doesn't want homosexuals to get married. They respect marriage and maybe thats only because they know how precious it is since it's a right they don't have, but they do respect it. And if you see a gay person getting married it's for the right reasons, it's for love, it's most likley gonna last, it's because they are devoted. Just because Bush is the potato ing president, he shouldn't have the right to take away peoples happiness.
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Post by Charles Vane on Feb 28, 2004 23:41:12 GMT -5
I think it's illegal as a whole though you always have jokes about it..
We have lots of definitions of marriage. I think gay couples could fit into one of those definitions. It's two people who love each other, not a guy who wants to be greedy and marry as many people as he can. Oh but is polygamy just males having multiple wives or can women marry more too?
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Post by Brian on Feb 29, 2004 13:25:11 GMT -5
Dunno about polygamy, but I'm all for gay marriage.
I even e-mailed president@whitehouse.gov (Bush himself) to protest that amendment he wants to pass, but I got one of those "message undeliverable" replies.
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Post by Charles Vane on Feb 29, 2004 22:03:35 GMT -5
Theres just something about polygamy that seems so.. degrading to the multiple spouses. I just don't think you really truly love all those people you'd be marrying. And ok maybe you do but all the cases I've heard of, the women didn't even know the man was married to anyone but them.
I didn't know if it was only the man who could have more than one spouse or not. When polygamy was started it was just so men could marry more wives, not women, so I wasn't sure. So ok if we've got polygamy then a man can marry 5 wives, each of those wives marry 5 husbands, and so on. Where would it end?
I think marriage is the union of two people who love each other. And thats not what marriage is to most people anyway. So why not let some people who are actually in love get married even if they are of the same sex?
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Post by Madamluna on Feb 29, 2004 22:10:27 GMT -5
Theres just something about polygamy that seems so.. degrading to the multiple spouses. I just don't think you really truly love all those people you'd be marrying. And ok maybe you do but all the cases I've heard of, the women didn't even know the man was married to anyone but them. Well, if I were the queen of Americaland, then on the subject of polygamy, I'd probably allow it but keep a constraint on it, like "you have to tell your partner any additional spouses you have" and "you can't have any more than five" or something like that. I think the concept of open relationships is a good idea, since obviously a whole buncha people in the US cheat on each other anyway.
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Post by Brian on Mar 1, 2004 17:53:33 GMT -5
I don't know if this was mentioned, but Rosie O'Donell got married! Good for her!
She's lesbian, if you didn't know that.
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