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Post by gliquey on Jun 26, 2016 15:22:00 GMT -5
Dashiell Qwerty is the member of V.F.D. responsible for spying on Snicket and Theodora during their time at Stain'd-by-the-Sea. We hear him arguing with Theodora about his evaluation of her during ?4, but how exactly does he know anything about what she has been doing? He recommends Caviar to Lemony, an essential book relating to Hangfire's plans - why?
He also seems to be linked to Kit's subplot. Lemony and Theodora are directed to Stain'd-by-the-Sea instead of their original plan of staying in the City to try and stop Lemony and Kit from stealing the mysterious item from a museum. Qwerty is supposed to be keeping an eye on the two - has he been told about the Snickets' plan? When Lemony sends a message to his sister in ?1, through requesting a fake book, Qwerty must know what he's trying to do, but he still sends the request and makes sure Lemony hears what book Kit requested back. In ?3, Lemony has a newspaper article about Kit, and Qwerty notices him trying to hide it, but as far as I can tell doesn't ever get to read the article. And in ?4, he's locked up on the train in the cell next to Kit. How much does Qwerty know about Kit, and does he want to help or hinder the theft?
Qwerty is living in Stain'd in ?1 - presumably, he's been there for a while before Snicket arrived. Is it a complete coincidence that a V.F.D. member was hanging around the town being targeted by Hangfire, a man who proclaims his hatred of the organisation? What was Qwerty's original purpose in the town - was he originally there to spy on Hangfire?
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Post by Dante on Jun 26, 2016 16:22:34 GMT -5
I've come to this post a bit late in the day to formulate any particularly unified conclusion, but here are my impressions: It's possible that V.F.D. stations people like Qwerty in all areas of interest to them or under their observation, to take care of various duties which include monitoring chaperones and apprentices working in the area. (Maybe all librarians are volunteers; we don't know.) This accounts for Qwerty's presence in the town since, apparently, long before Theodora and Lemony showed up, but also suggests how he might already have become aware of Hangfire's plot and wish to play a silent role in helping to defeat it. We don't need to ask just how he knows quite what he knows, in much the same way that it's hard to understand how he could observe Lemony and Theodora whilst holding down a sub-librarianship, or how Lemony could have such a detailed knowledge of the Baudelaires' activities; research is a very effective tool in the Averse, let's leave it at that.
As to how he relates to Kit's subplot: Qwerty is implied, at least, to be somewhat young. I take it that he is aligned with, or at least sympathetic to, the intentions and ideals of the Snicket regarding how V.F.D. should evolve and what kind of organisation they want it to be. Thus he facilitates what is, to a person in his position, a transparent attempt at covert communication, because he sees no reason to stop it. Likewise, he doesn't interfere with Lemony's newspaper article about Kit's imprisonment, and frankly I imagine he already knows; it's more than conceivable Qwerty was the volunteer who smuggled that article to Snicket in the first place.
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Post by Hermes on Jun 27, 2016 9:02:09 GMT -5
I think it actually says in ?4, in one of the scenes with Walleye and co., that most librarians are volunteers. So, that provides a VFD network everywhere, though perhaps it is often a sleeper network, not doing much until some special circumstance arises.
The connection of Qwerty with Kit is indeed puzzling; though perhaps it was more confusing when we assumed L and K's plot was against the wishes of the VFD leadership, which now seems not to be the case. I have wondered before now whether Qwerty's description of himself as a sub-librarian may mean that at one point he had an apprentice who has links with Kit.
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Post by lorelai on Jun 27, 2016 13:55:33 GMT -5
I think we also need to consider how much Kit and Querty are thematicly linked because that's probably part of why that connection is tricky to resolve. In roughly the first two books, their behavior/purpose or actions, kind of respectively since all of these descriptives are different, are what defines them, and we know we're supposed to like them (unlike Ellington, who we may like, but aren't sure if we can trust). Then in the second half of the series, they're people who are in trouble, but one requires Lemony's help while the other is someone he'd like to help. I know that doesn't answer any questions, but may be something to keep in mind.
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Post by gliquey on Jun 28, 2016 10:52:41 GMT -5
I think those are all very helpful responses.
I do wish the books had gone into V.F.D. in a bit more detail - while ASOUE got TUA and TBL, ATWQ got FU13, which was certainly a very good book but more a collection of short stories than an exploration of the Averse. I feel like there was a lot more about Lemony's childhood that could have been said. Qwerty's relationship with the organisation is just one aspect of this - Hangfire's hatred of the group, Lemony's disagreements and Kit's actions in the series could all have had more explanation, in my opinion.
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Post by Dante on Jun 28, 2016 12:33:33 GMT -5
Well, I suppose that's a Lemony Snicket series for you. Daniel Handler is very interested in asking us to exercise our imagination. On which note, I hope I provided adequate answers to these problems in The Stain'd Myth Murders.
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Post by gliquey on Jun 29, 2016 10:27:47 GMT -5
Well, I suppose that's a Lemony Snicket series for you. Daniel Handler is very interested in asking us to exercise our imagination. On which note, I hope I provided adequate answers to these problems in The Stain'd Myth Murders. Yes, your last novel had a much clearer resolution. That doesn't necessarily make it better or worse, but I suppose closure is expected in a children's story - I have one friend who was very annoyed when they finished TE and still had many unanswered questions. It does suit Lemony's style of writing, and I personally think ASOUE ended perfectly, but I still don't feel ATWQ is fully finished.
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Post by Dante on Jun 29, 2016 14:58:38 GMT -5
The End rather blindsided quite a few of us; I strongly suspect that Mr. Handler simply isn't too fussed about a lot of the details, though. It's there in his lack of extraneous character description, the almost total absence of times and dates, the sometimes improbable or confusing meanderings of spatial relation. It's strange to think, considering his poetical musings and autobiographical tangents, but in terms of concrete details, Snicket's writing style is often quite clipped.
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Post by Hermes on Jun 29, 2016 16:10:39 GMT -5
Yes, The End was quite a shock when it happened, though in retrospect it's clear that he had been telling us, at least since TGG, that we wouldn't discover the answer to everything. Most of the questions we were puzzling over in the middle of the series are answered; many of the questions that are not answered seem to have been introduced quite late, for the express purpose of not being answered. But many people were expecting an overall Answer that would make everything clear, and that, of course, we did not get.
I'm interested that you find ATWQ less fully finished that ASOUE; it does at least give an Answer to the central mystery in a way that ASOUE doesn't (mainly because there is no one central mystery, but still). But its certainly true that much remains puzzling. I suppose if he clarified it all, that would remove opportunities both for fannish speculation and for further writing by Mr Snicket (and indeed, even the rather cryptic information we got about the background to ASOUE has constrained ATWQ in some ways, as we are discussing in another thread right now).
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Post by gliquey on Jun 29, 2016 17:01:16 GMT -5
I'm interested that you find ATWQ less fully finished that ASOUE; it does at least give an Answer to the central mystery in a way that ASOUE doesn't (mainly because there is no one central mystery, but still). But its certainly true that much remains puzzling. Well with ASOUE I felt that everything necessary to be answered was - we know what happens to the Baudelaires, essentially (not what happens to them after they leave the island but at the end of Chapter Fourteen they seem safe and happy). We at least have some conclusion about the Quagmires - they are lost to some mysterious thing, the Great Unknown, and will never be seen again. But perhaps most significantly, the series ends with the discovery of who Beatrice is: it ends on an answer. ATWQ ends on a question: what happens to Lemony? Hangfire is dead, but every other character's future is unknown. In the distant future, of course, we know where Lemony and Kit end up, but Lemony gets no closure on Hangfire's death: his friends don't really forgive him, nor vow never to speak to him again. We end with an injustice - Ellington locked up instead of Stew - and with Snicket on a mysterious journey into the Clusterous Forest. Perhaps I am biased because I've had years to think about the end of ASOUE, while ?4 was released less than a year ago. But then, that's true of everyone - perhaps because I never experienced the hype leading up to TE, it never subverted any of my expectations. I did enjoy the ending to ATWQ but it is still a mystery.
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Post by lorelai on Jul 1, 2016 12:56:59 GMT -5
I liked that it ended on a mystery. While yes, as readers we want more concrete endings with firm resolutions, it was very fitting in terms of being 13 and having the unknown stretched out ahead of you, which in a way is how both series end for all the main characters even if the narrative tells us more, or leaves us hanging. And it appears we may need at least another book, according to this site's latest dastardly document, to explain either VFD or what happened between ATWQ and ASOUE.
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