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Post by BSam on Oct 16, 2003 18:04:10 GMT -5
so is that not as bad as having homosexual thoughts or actions?
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Post by Quigley on Oct 16, 2003 19:39:23 GMT -5
I don't understand, though. I mean, how can we let something called "sin" control us? There's no such thing as sin, man. I don't mean that in a sacreligious way or anything...it's just that (well, like in Little Nicky "sin is in" no just kidding). I don't know, it's hard to explain. I mean, I'm not gay, but I don't see anything wrong with it, you know. Love is love, no matter what form it is or anything. Love is free, be yourself, and all that jazz. I don't mean to be offensive, but most of the stuff the bible says is meant to conform us all to the same person with the same ideals and thoughts. Branch out.
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Post by Kobolos on Oct 16, 2003 20:02:55 GMT -5
From my own viewpoint there is a little thing called the threefold rule..whatever you send out into the world will come back to you threefold...you are held accountable for your own actions...ergo you are not forgiven your trespasses, nor are you restricted to a set of rules other than and it harm none, do as thou wilt. Fairly simple, and you can write it on a card. No tablets required.
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Post by BSam on Oct 16, 2003 20:25:44 GMT -5
threefold rule... wiccan? or pagan? or other?
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Post by pennyroyal on Oct 16, 2003 21:39:38 GMT -5
a question... if everyone is living in sin(let he who is without sin cast the first stone etc...) does it really matter what sort of sin it is? to this question... sin is sin. there are no levels.
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Post by Kobolos on Oct 16, 2003 21:45:09 GMT -5
threefold rule... wiccan? or pagan? or other? Depends on how you look at it... www.draknetfree.com/sheathomas/concept.htmlMost common use was adopted from the popular "Eight words the Wiccan Rede fulfill – an’ it harm none, do what ye will" and before that, Crowley's : “Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.” As for dear Isadore Kobolos personally? Chalk me up as an eclectic journeyman. But how can we let sin control us? Just in general terms of how can we let sin be our witch What does that mean by chance? *G* Anyways, love is love? Let me point out the pedophile example again. If homosexuality is okay is pedophilia all right as well? How do you guys feel about beastality (crap, I'm not even sure if I spelled that right but I'm talking about the love between man/animals)? Are there no boundaries? No limitations? And if there are.. how do we set those standards? I think Ms. Garafolo said it best in Truth about Cats and Dogs : "You can love your pet...just dont' LOVE your pet." That said...how do you compare consential sex between two adults on the same level with the abuse of a child and the abuse of an animal?
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Post by Tay Sachs on Oct 17, 2003 4:45:25 GMT -5
The difference though is that you can assume two homosexuals are both adults and both willingly entering into a relationship. A child is incapable, physically, emotionally and legally, of making any decision for themselves, and therefore anything an adult would do to a child would be without the child's consent. The church I grew up in taught us sexual feelings were temptation and if resisted and not indulged mentally (Ie sitting around and thinking about it all day) weren't a sin. The Eatern Catholic church's standpoint on the matter is "homosexual feelings are some people's cross to bear. If they resist the urges, they haven't sinned." And another thing...the bible doesn't actually mention lesbians, does it? Maybe there weren't any back in the day, I don't know. I will say no more on this subject ever. *Sits down.*
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Post by Kobolos on Oct 17, 2003 8:12:39 GMT -5
Again this is just the rambling thoughts of a pointy eared goblin in a suit...
Swans:It all boils down to common sense....If I am a 55 year old man, and I want to get my jollies with a child, I am a sick individual, my religious notions aside.. If I want to be with a woman (or man in which case I have had something put in my drink ) and that person wants to be with me...we are consenting and there should be nothing wrong with that. If on the other hand, I take a wrong turn and someone has their way with me at knifepoint then it is obviously wrong...and they have the problem, just as the pedophile does. This is as clear as day to me.
What bothers me is that Christians often have the impression that without the Ten Commandments and the Bible to guide the world well everyone will just murder and sin and be hopelessly bad people...a person should have the common sense and personal responsibility to KNOW animals are not made for lovin', they should KNOW that it is hideous to take advantage of a child in that way to KNOW murdering is wrong, to KNOW lying is wrong...heck Merlin even said "when a man lies he murders a part of the world" (Excalibur by the way)
When I was 18, I was dating a girl one year my junior...but she was under the age of consent...because her mother did not like me, and mose assuredly would send me to jail. I took the personal responsibility of not doing myself harm and thereby resisted temptation...but in my mind consential sex is not a sin if it is among two (or 4 or 8) people of legal consenting age and most of all, of a certain level of maturity.
I personally believe the thought that homosexuality is a choice...but one that can be intergrated into your thought process at an early age...just like religious beliefs...If you were raised Southern Baptist, you may be Southern Baptist all your life...or you may reach a point in your life and ask "what else is there?" and explore the world...it's really up to the individual. As Peach said, their cross to bear.
Peach: I hesitate to say this, but there is the case that can be made of Ruth and Naomi in the Bible...*covers face with his hat*
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Post by Kobolos on Oct 17, 2003 11:58:52 GMT -5
You guys are misreading me. I'm saying if it's okay for people to have homosexual urges, and that's normal. Is it normal for pedophiles to have urges like that? Or do you guys consider that sick? If you do-- what's the difference? I'm not talking about raping a child, I'm not talking about committing the act-- and if it is wrong to have thoughts of rape, why? So it is "normal" for people to have homosexual urges as long as the thoughts involve consenting adults? So it's wrong to be a homosexual if you also have urges for someone who is say not of legal age-- like say a fifteen year old? If this study somehow proves people are homosexual due to genes, what about rape? What if there is something in the brain about that? What if it is genetic to be a pedophile? I understand the difference between consenting adults and raping someone. I understand that perfectly, and I get people should understand rape is wrong automatically. But I'm talking THOUGHTS here not ACTIONS. And yeah, I am a Southern Baptist living in the bible belt and I can explore world, and I think that is what I'm trying to do. I'm trying to understand if love is love why people consider it different for pedophiles and rapists. Common sense does tell you why but I'm not talking about actions. It's wrong to force someone-- duh. That's been well established and I've never refuted that. I'm talking THOUGHTS. Just thoughts and no actions-- should it matter or is it abnormal to have some thoughts? First I apologize if I misread. And second, yes, it's sorta messed up to think of a child that way.. That said, why would a fully functional adult mind entertain the notion of having sex with a child? What age is appropriate for those kind of thoughts? Look at Brittany Spears when she first came onto the scene.. The schoolgirl outfit is one of the hottest selling costumes for sexual roleplay (or Wonder Woman if you are Robert Downey Jr.) I admit I've seen many 15 and 16 year old girls who look WAY older...and dress WAY older...is it wrong for me to think about having my way with them? Yeah, for me it is...because I'm way too old and way too poor to be a sugar daddy. *G* I can see where swan is going now...it does raise some interesting questions. Why are some men attracted to men? why are some women attracted to women? Why am I attracted to When I was a child, I thought Asian women were the most beautiful creatures in the world...I had never met an person of Asian heritage, I don't know where I got this opinion from...maybe on the TV... but I loved them. This was at age 5...(and no, I *never* went through a "girls have cooties phase) eventually I had a thing for redheads and Mrs. Kobolos is a brunette. I was never that attracted to blonds, but I have seen many attractive blonds...what shapes our likes and at what age do we aquire the tastes we later pursue in life? it is said that everyone will have homosexual thoughts about someone at least once in their life...I don't pursue it because it holds no interest to me...it may be someone's cup of tea and that's great. I applaud swan for living in the Belt and being open minded to the rest of the world...having escaped there I encourage you to devour everything and make your own decisions what you choose to believe and not conform to the too frequent mindset of the area...
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Post by Kobolos on Oct 17, 2003 13:06:01 GMT -5
I like my area, and I think people stereotype us too much.. and even if we do act a certain way-- so what? Doesn't really bother me in fact it usually makes me laugh when someone tells me I'm so completely ignorant and close minded when they don't even bother to listen to me, or assume they already know what I'm going to say just because of my beliefs. Hypocritical to the max there. Anyways, thank you for actually listening and seeing my point. That said I'll comment more intelligently later though I think I've already expressed my views on attraction.. EDIT: And, yeah it seems messed up for a grown man/woman to have those thoughts about children. But it happens and some people may feel those urges are wrong and some don't. Some people see it as normal and OKAY as long as they don't entertain the notion. [shrugs] I spent the first 16 years of my life as a devout Southern Baptist...hearing people espout "If it ain't King James, it ain't Bible!" and some people will live their entire lives there in the Belt knowing only one way of thinking...what you have to decide is...will you be pigeon-holed into being what the majority thinks...what bothers me IS the close-mindedness...isn't it much better to have something that works for *you* and not what everyone thinks is proper? Anywhoo, I'm glad you don't fall into the stereotypes...and I look forward to your comments.
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Post by pennyroyal on Oct 22, 2003 17:28:14 GMT -5
BAD EXAMPLE.
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Post by Quigley on Oct 22, 2003 21:13:18 GMT -5
*snorts*
*recovers*
I think it's great if you can just friggin' be who you are.
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Post by Colton on Oct 24, 2003 23:29:28 GMT -5
i thought greenberry was kicked...
im not homophobic.. but they are kinda freaky, yaknow, if they are all touchy feelly... but its allright, just as long as they dont like dryhump me in my sleep or anything, and DONT HIT ON STRAIGHT GUYS!!! God damnit!
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Post by CountOlaf on Oct 24, 2003 23:31:55 GMT -5
I guess im homopho...whatever. I know a couple of people i am pretty sure are gay. Cause yesterday, i saw two boys...well this will explain it better:
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Post by Colton on Oct 26, 2003 16:49:34 GMT -5
omg thats nasty!!! how did you do that, animated GIF. 's?
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