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Post by Grace on Sept 9, 2006 8:12:51 GMT -5
"Toot, toot" I just wanted to toot my own horn. It was I who started the thread about there being two Beatrices. After I met Mr. Handler and he said "Just because it's one name, doesn't necessarily mean it's one person." Yes, I did notice that, and I was about to say something. Bravo. And can someone please tell me what the hidden image is on the cover? I thought there was JS, and then someone said there were two Beatrices on it. EDIT: Possible Beatrice Baudelaires: -Mother to the Baudelaires -Aunt to the Baudelaires (which means Baudelaire is not her maiden name) -Cousin to the Baudelaires -Sibling (or half-sibling) to the Baudelaires (which could mean that L and BB#1 had a love child, and then she married Bertrand) So BB#1 and BB#2 each have to be one of these, or else they're not conceivably related to the Baudelaires. |
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Post by jman on Sept 9, 2006 9:06:53 GMT -5
Fallen from Grace: Look for another Beatrice outlined by the back of the original Beatrice's hair.
Lauren: In TUA, it states that Beatrice and Lemony were engaged (Vineyard of Fragrant Drapes), but the Sebald Code warned them away.And also, in his theatrical review Lemony states that he is prejudiced due to his being engaged to Beatrice, and Eleanora Poe backs it up.
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Post by Dear Dairy on Sept 9, 2006 9:33:17 GMT -5
Yes, jman and laura, the more I think about the unrequited love theory, the less sense it makes. It was brought on by the idea that "LS is not who we think he is" (13 Shocking Secrets) and the references to Lemony as an "unreliable narrator" (LSUA), which made me wonder about the other side of the story, the one that could be "wildly different" (TBL) from actual events.
Regarding the sonnet: I don't think we'll decode it (if it is coded) without the key. Verse Fluctuation Declaration doesn't seem to work. I Googled the first few lines - which should provide the famous sonnet that forms the basis for this coded sonnet - but came up empty. I don't think it's coded by Verse Fluctuation Declaration. It could be that DH will provide the key in "The End," and then all will become clear. But I doubt anything will ever become clear. Snicket is turning me into such a pessimist!
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Post by beatriceblake on Sept 9, 2006 10:32:17 GMT -5
I don't have much about to say about which Beatrice is which or who either of them are in relation to the Baudelaires or Lemony. This may be an unpopular opinion but I am a little disappointed with TBL. It is more confusing than TUA and frankly right now I feel like it was just a way for Handler to make more money before the series ends.
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Post by joshspazjosh on Sept 9, 2006 11:14:58 GMT -5
More confusing is better. . .you're getting your money's worth.
It was 80 pages long. . .13 letters. Would you rather want something that you'll read once or something that you'll be analyzing for months?
I felt like I got my $20 worth. . .
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MWC
Reptile Researcher
Posts: 39
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Post by MWC on Sept 9, 2006 11:37:33 GMT -5
I must say the punch-out letters are (for me at least) extremely hard to remove from the book, and I didn't realise that the "U" was a "U" at first.
Although I don't think the extreme levels of fanciness used were completely necessary.
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Post by maralenenok on Sept 9, 2006 12:54:11 GMT -5
For what it's worth, "my silence knot" seems linked to the idea of "The world is quiet here," and also brings to mind the knots tied by the FFP. I noticed that, too. They're such lovely, evocative phrases. Other people have already addressed the idea that Beatrice wasn't in love with Lemony, so I'll just add that 1) she says, "I cannot speak to one for whom I care" -- unless that doesn't refer to LS (unlikely), she does say she cares for him, and 2) writing a 200 page rejection doesn't exactly indicate a lack of affection. EDIT: In addition to interpreting the sonnet itself, we should be looking for a coded message. Promos for TBL definitely indicate "coded sonnets." I was thinking that perhaps the first letters of each line are an anagram, sort of like in The Vile Village: M A I A I A T A M H A T T T You can spell "I am at a" or "I am that" or "I am a" but I can't make anything from the remaining letters. Argh, it's such an odd little sonnet. I feel like I've got a handle on the first four lines and the couplet, but other things... What's the meaning of the 10th line? "His solitude might not just be an act?" What's so suspicious about living in solitude? And what letter does she refer to in lines 11 and 12? The one that was accidentally sent to R? My head hurts, but at least I had something to think about on the plane. |
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Post by Libitina on Sept 9, 2006 13:00:08 GMT -5
Hmm, there is a ring on someone's finger on the cover of TUA (the actual cover, not the dust jacket). Could that be the ring mentioned throughout TBL?
I also thought of something odd, although it probably isn't true. Beatrice 1 is said to be friends with R., who is probably an imposter. Lemony also mentions something about her betraying her father by marrying him (which was a reason she couldn't marry him). Could Beatrice's family, perhaps, be part of the other side of the schism, explaining why Beatrice 1 and Lemony couldn't get married? After all, didn't the schism occur after they both had joined V.F.D.? In that case, they could have met and then been separated once they broke off onto different sides. It's really Romeo and Juliet, but it's possible.
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Post by Sixteen on Sept 9, 2006 16:14:02 GMT -5
LS to BB #5: "...and I will love you until C. realizes S. is not worthy of his love..."
Absolutely Sir/Charles. That made me laugh out loud.
The discussion about TE being referred to as B13 on the cover is pretty much squashed. On the inside cover of the booklet there is a list of all the aSoUE books, and 13 is listed as The End.
I have ideas on what Beatrice's questions were in her book, but it's taken so long to read this thread that I don't have the time to type them up.
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Post by maralenenok on Sept 9, 2006 16:21:22 GMT -5
LS to BB #5: "...and I will love you until C. realizes S. is not worthy of his love..."Absolutely Sir/Charles. That made me laugh out loud. Oh, that's brilliant! I'd been thinking about who LS might mean, and you're right, of course. I myself am wondering why Beatrice asked Lemony about his siblings, not once, but twice. |
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Post by superorange on Sept 9, 2006 16:22:16 GMT -5
Whoever keeps calling "Bertrand" "Betram" cut it out. D:
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Post by Sixteen on Sept 9, 2006 16:51:25 GMT -5
In LS to BB #2, Lemony's name is written in Braille. Probably not significant, but interesting nonetheless.
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Post by s on Sept 9, 2006 17:17:01 GMT -5
LS to BB #5: "...and I will love you until C. realizes S. is not worthy of his love..."Absolutely Sir/Charles. That made me laugh out loud. Ahahahaha, I never thought of that. That's wonderful. |
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Post by superorange on Sept 9, 2006 18:01:19 GMT -5
Aw, that's so sweet. I'm really happy that Daniel just through away all of the "hints" and just came out and said in his kids book that there's nothing wrong with gay marraige, of gay couples.
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Post by Sora on Sept 9, 2006 18:01:23 GMT -5
LS to BB #5: "...and I will love you until C. realizes S. is not worthy of his love..."Absolutely Sir/Charles. That made me laugh out loud. Oh, that's brilliant! I'd been thinking about who LS might mean, and you're right, of course. I myself am wondering why Beatrice asked Lemony about his siblings, not once, but twice. That interested me as as well. Especially since Jacques would have been dead at this point. This may mean that Kit does not die in The End, as hinted in 13 Shocking Secrets. |
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