lunafan12
Reptile Researcher
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Posts: 30
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Post by lunafan12 on Oct 15, 2007 18:50:52 GMT -5
Another quote from TBL: "and I will love until C realises S is not worthy of his love" C=Charles? S=Sir? That's what i thought. |
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Post by fordxprefect on Oct 16, 2007 10:39:55 GMT -5
Yah. In TMM Charles says he cares about Sir, but I don't think Sir cares about him back.
I do remember that part in TBL, luna. . .I think. . .so the topic is pretty much settled.
Why wouldn't Daniel Handler put gay characters in the book? Afraid of the Four Horseman of Censorship. . .Violence, Sex, Religion, and Profanity?
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Post by melon head. on Nov 21, 2007 0:14:09 GMT -5
I'm all for gay rights, but Charles seems to put up with Sir only because he needs his job. He just seems so fed up with him, especially in PP, that I don't think that he could have ever really loved him in that way. However, after reading that comment in TBL, I'm wondering if Charles is constantly trying to get some sense into Sir so that he will become a more noble person, and then he won't be ashamed to declare his love. It's quite interesting.
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Post by violet on Nov 25, 2007 12:49:57 GMT -5
Another quote from TBL: "and I will love until C realises S is not worthy of his love" C=Charles? S=Sir? That's what i thought. Me too. And the quote also implies that it will be a long time before Charles fiannaly relizes that Sir is a self-centered jerk (or maybe he never relizes it) |
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Post by Very Funky Disco on Jan 20, 2008 16:38:57 GMT -5
I was trying to figure out who the C and the S were. The only thing is, I don't think Sir would be his first name - but I guess Lemony was just using the name everyone knew him as. I certainly don't have any problems with Charles being gay, but I do think he deserves a better partner. I mean, he seems like a decent enough person - but, if he loved Sir, I think that would really get in the way of him doing the right thing.
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Post by lilmizpiper on Feb 29, 2008 2:40:25 GMT -5
Lol, it reminds me of the whole Burns-Smithers relationship in Simpsons. Smithers is gay & lusts for Mr. Burns but Mr. Burns is oblivious to it all, lol.
Daniel Handler was DEFINITLY implying it tho.
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Post by Liam R. Findlay on Oct 11, 2008 5:40:12 GMT -5
These are childrens books! Think of all the complaining parents if there were gay business partners running a lumber mill! I don't see why they shouldn't have that sexuality, but really, they're just business partners. They hardly get along anyway.
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Post by Dante on Oct 11, 2008 6:52:39 GMT -5
Certainly it's unclear if Sir thinks of Charles that way, but the other way around, well...
And the potential complaints from parents is why Handler would have had to be so subtle about it.
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Post by Liam R. Findlay on Oct 11, 2008 9:24:32 GMT -5
The C and S thing could be any characters in the world of Lemony Snicket- Charles and Sir (which isn't even his real name) are just two possibilities.
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Post by Dante on Oct 11, 2008 10:23:12 GMT -5
Are you saying that it can be interpreted as canonically not necessarily referring to Charles and Sir - or are you saying that Handler personally wasn't referring to Charles and Sir when he wrote it? The former I would agree with, if one particularly disliked Sir/Charles as a ship, but Handler almost certainly was referring to them, particularly when the following reference is to Nero and the violin (and when he'd hinted at Sir/Charles in the previous book, TPP). You'd be hard-pressed to find any other characters he could have been alluding to; male C. forenames and S. forenames of any gender are uncommon and usually belong to incredibly obscure characters or literary allusions.
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Post by Liam R. Findlay on Oct 11, 2008 14:15:06 GMT -5
I'm afraid my mind is too ignorant to understand the previous comment, but I get the gist of it! I'll conclude that I think that in the end, Sir and Charles are purely business partners who've been involved in the plot as guardians of the Baudelaires (and main characters). Any hints that Handler may have made are probably just to be ambiguous- to open possibilities. However, it's an interesting, if not odd thought... So, I think I'll stick to reading T.M.M. and T.P.P. as I always have, and not start seeing those two characters as a couple!
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missrea
Bewildered Beginner
Posts: 4
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Post by missrea on Nov 21, 2012 23:14:44 GMT -5
I definitely think so.
I like their conversations, especially their private one in the sauna when Charles said that he cared for Sir.
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Post by Seymour Glass on Jul 18, 2013 18:25:47 GMT -5
I think they're definitely gay.
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Post by wstickman on Oct 17, 2013 16:17:56 GMT -5
DH is good friends with Stephin Merritt (an openly gay man), has written several stories about homosexual love, and once had a boyfriend (not making that up). He's obviously supportive of gay rights, and it certainly seems like him to push the boundaries of a children's book by inserting a gay couple.
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occono
Bewildered Beginner
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Post by occono on Jan 20, 2017 5:31:11 GMT -5
These are childrens books! Think of all the complaining parents if there were gay business partners running a lumber mill! I don't see why they shouldn't have that sexuality, but really, they're just business partners. They hardly get along anyway. Nearly a decade later, they're pretty explicitly a gay couple on a TV show where parents will actually be watching it with their children. How times change. |
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