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Post by lsandthebooks on Sept 18, 2019 19:23:48 GMT -5
In Book 3, there's this paragraph:
So...what if it was all the result of a failed trap? The Baudelaire parents might have had a plan to evade Olaf, on the day of the fire. That would explain why the parents forced the kids to go to the beach that day.
Like how the Unauthorized Autobiography says, the Dairy fire happened right before the Baudelaire fire...
And so, the Baudelaire parents couldn't stay in their mansion anymore. They knew Olaf would visit them soon, and they would need to go into hiding to keep their children safe. The parents decided to fake their own deaths.
But their plan failed. They were supposed to escape through the secret passageway, but it was locked...
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Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Sept 18, 2019 20:03:05 GMT -5
Like how the Unauthorized Autobiography says, the Dairy fire happened right before the Baudelaire fire... One detail Isandthebooks: The Dairy fire happened after the Baudelaire Mansion fire. When the cow-disguised villain was near Dairy, book 2 had already been published, after all, the villain read information from book 2 before disguising himself as a cow. Also, someone who calls himself "K" and claims to be Lemony's sister, wrote to Dairy after the hospital H fire. In addition, someone used Mr. Helquist's illustration of the mansion B fire as if it had been of the Dairy fire. So everything points to the Dairy fire occurring after the mansion B fire ... I believe after a few years, because book 2 reports about Klaus not being able to sleep properly after a few years. So...what if it was all the result of a failed trap? The Baudelaire parents might have had a plan to evade Olaf, on the day of the fire. That would explain why the parents forced the kids to go to the beach that day. ... And so, the Baudelaire parents couldn't stay in their mansion anymore. They knew Olaf would visit them soon, and they would need to go into hiding to keep their children safe. The parents decided to fake their own deaths. But their plan failed. They were supposed to escape through the secret passageway, but it was locked... I think the word "trap" is being used in TWW to refer to a fate trap, not a Baudelaire parent trap. But I support you in your quest to understand why the Baudelaire parents insisted so much on them leaving home that day, how Mr. Poe learned where they were, how their bodies mysteriously disappeared, and who the mysterious survivor would be. It's not Quigley.
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Post by lsandthebooks on Sept 18, 2019 20:55:50 GMT -5
Like how the Unauthorized Autobiography says, the Dairy fire happened right before the Baudelaire fire... One detail Isandthebooks: The Dairy fire happened after the Baudelaire Mansion fire. When the cow-disguised villain was near Dairy, book 2 had already been published, after all, the villain read information from book 2 before disguising himself as a cow. Also, someone who calls himself "K" and claims to be Lemony's sister, wrote to Dairy after the hospital H fire. In addition, someone used Mr. Helquist's illustration of the mansion B fire as if it had been of the Dairy fire. So everything points to the Dairy fire occurring after the mansion B fire ... I believe after a few years, because book 2 reports about Klaus not being able to sleep properly after a few years. So...what if it was all the result of a failed trap? The Baudelaire parents might have had a plan to evade Olaf, on the day of the fire. That would explain why the parents forced the kids to go to the beach that day. ... And so, the Baudelaire parents couldn't stay in their mansion anymore. They knew Olaf would visit them soon, and they would need to go into hiding to keep their children safe. The parents decided to fake their own deaths. But their plan failed. They were supposed to escape through the secret passageway, but it was locked... I think the word "trap" is being used in TWW to refer to a fate trap, not a Baudelaire parent trap. But I support you in your quest to understand why the Baudelaire parents insisted so much on them leaving home that day, how Mr. Poe learned where they were, how their bodies mysteriously disappeared, and who the mysterious survivor would be. It's not Quigley. Well, Esme may have bought the penthouse before the day of the fire. So it's possible that the Baudelaire parents were anticipating an attack from her at anytime.
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Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Sept 18, 2019 21:16:33 GMT -5
We got into that cycle ... When Esme went to Dark Avenue 667. Jerome said a few weeks, but he bought it at the time of Lemony's wedding cancellation. Did Jerome live there for a while, and then move from there, and then back there?
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Post by Dante on Sept 19, 2019 3:37:13 GMT -5
It's not especially clear that such a trap or ruse would have kept their children safe, and one raises an eyebrow at the idea of the Baudelaire parents faking their deaths so incompetently as to actually kill themselves in the process. Surely they would have checked that the trapdoor was unlocked. And surely they would have faked their whole family's death so that their children too could be smuggled away to a place of safety, rather than left to the mercies of Mr. Poe's inept guidance and a prey to terrible grief.
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Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Sept 19, 2019 11:32:05 GMT -5
Yes, I agree Dante. For my ideas about Beatrice pretending death itself to work, it is necessary to assume some assumptions as Beatrice believed that children would go to their genetically close relatives (this seems reasonable, based on TBB); Beatrice has planned this for many years (this is controversial, but I support the idea based on my understanding of TBL); Beatrice spent several weeks in hiding without contact with the outside world as she had prepared the necessary supplies to fake her death. (This is a hypothesis without textual support, it is true. But it is a conclusion that I came to based on the events); after a few weeks, Beatrice exited the tunnel through the secret trapdoor (this is a conclusion I came up with from TEE, where the postman states that Beatrice's neighbors said the ground was haunted. I conclude that they came to that conclusion by some saw Beatrice coming out of the ground. Seeing someone they thought was dead, many assumed it was a ghost of Beatrice.); as they scanned the tunnel, the experts came to the conclusion that there could be a survivor of the fire (I believe this is a reasonable conclusion, as on page 13 there is a picture of the dark avenue 667 building. What connects Beatrice's house with that building is the secret tunnel, so it is reasonable to deduce that the experts when analyzing the tunnel came to the conclusion that it was possible that one of the Baudelarie's parents had survived. Something that the experts saw in that tunnel or in that building made them believe that that one and only one of the Baudelaires' parents survived the fire. The only thing I can think of is that they found one of the bodies. If the body found was burned, it would show that the temperature of the fire was not high enough to do so. the bodies turn to ashes only. Thus, the absence of one of the bodies would show the possibility of survival of one of them. If the body was not burned, that would be evidence that they fled and one of them died for another cause, not the fire. By allowing myself to level up on my house of cards deductions, I would say that there is a possibility that the cause of Bertrand's death is poisoning. After all, in TBB: RE there is evidence that a case of poisoning was thought by Daniel Handler. A poisonous plant was stolen from the Royal Gardens. However, in what context was this poisonous plant used? I would say there is a possibility that the poisonous plant was used by Beatrice to kill Bertrand. After all, killer wives often use poisons to kill their husbands.
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Post by Foxy on Sept 19, 2019 12:23:46 GMT -5
I wonder why the family ever lived so close to Count Olaf to begin with, other than ASOUEland is maybe teeny-tiny.
Did the parents know how inept Mr. Poe was? I mean, it was in their will that he be the one to take care of them. As a parent, I can tell you - you don't leave your children to someone you don't trust to take care of them.
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Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Sept 19, 2019 12:37:50 GMT -5
I think Mr. Poe was someone they trusted who was not part of VFD. It is evident that Beatrice did not want her children to be involved with VFD on either side of the Schism.
About the Baudelaires living near Olaf, I believe what was happening was akin to a Risk game. Physically occupying a house was synonymous with having some kind of power. After all, the houses of VFD members were more than places to live. These were the places where the VFD libraries were located. These were places where members of the organization could meet and create secret plans. So when the incendiary side demolishes a house, it is actually an attack on VFD. And when you leave a house, realtors soon try to sell your house. But if the organization needs money, it needs to sell some real estate. And so Jacques didn't want Jerome to sell the penthouse. VFD had to sell the penthouse because it was experiencing financial problems after so many fires in its bases. But Jerome was advised never to sell the penthouse, as evidently people on the incendiary side would want to buy that penthouse. On the other hand, Esme quickly married Jerome, showing her intention to conquer a former VFD property.
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Post by Dante on Sept 22, 2019 4:22:22 GMT -5
I wonder why the family ever lived so close to Count Olaf to begin with, other than ASOUEland is maybe teeny-tiny. I think those just happened to be the locations of the homes they'd inherited from their own families; I doubt either side ever made a conscious decision to live within each other's vicinity. But it's worth remembering that the Baudelaire mansion and Olaf's house aren't actually that close together; just within the same city. It's a large city, and clearly an important one, given that to everyone in the surrounding country it's " the city" (emphasis mine); so it's not surprising that a lot of people would live there. Strictly speaking, Mr. Poe did his job correctly - up until the point Olaf started causing trouble. If Mr. Poe had placed the Baudelaires directly into the care of, say, Uncle Monty, we wouldn't think nearly so badly of him; but the fact is that the wording of the will and Mr. Poe's attempt at consideration for the children's comfort meant that an unanticipated situation arose.
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