Lemony is one of JS

[Optimism is my Phil-osophy]

I even commented on this in a text that was not mine, so I will write here so that you can explicitly disagree with me.

I want to remind you that I used to defend the idea that Beatrice, who had survived the fire, was one of the hotel's JS. More specifically, the person who sent a telegram to Poe and a letter to Charles asking for help to protect the children. At the time I stated that this was evidence that JS did not want the children in the hotel because she was concerned about their safety, and that I therefore stated that Beatrice would be the character that best suits this behavior. But I was wrong, because Beatrice was dead just as everyone had been trying to convince me for so long. And I was convinced after a lot of work by you. Thank you for not giving up on me.

But still, the question remained in my mind: who would that JS be? Well, as the title says, I believe that JS was Lemony Snicket. Lemony apparently started writing about the Baudelaires before the fire at Hospital H. According to LSTUA, some drafts of the introduction of TBB were sent to the record library. I still believe that Lemony managed to publish TBB years later. But it is significant that Lemony was already following in the footsteps of the Baudelaires whenever possible, during the main events recorded in ASOUE. This concept must have been in Daniel Handler's mind when he wrote TSS and TPP, since they were published after LSTUA.

Another concept developed at LSTUA is that siblings take care of each other's affairs after the death of one, according to Sally Sebald's letter to Lemony. Daniel Handler may have used this concept in TSS, TGG and TPP. After Jacques Snicket's death, Lemony Snicket took care of the business that Jacques Snicket was taking care of. Apparently Jacques Snicket was involved with the SB issue, as Quigley took first-hand information from Jacques on the subject. So, Lemony must have taken care of this matter after Jacques's death. Kit was also concerned about SB, and it is natural that she did not know that Lemony had the same concern, as she believed that most likely Lemony was dead. But Lemony was not dead. He was acting like JS. But evidently Lemony was concerned for the safety of the Baudelaires. While Kit believed it would be a good idea to send the Baudelaires to Hotel D, Lemony believed it was a very bad idea to send the Baudelaires to Hotel D. So what we see in TPP is the unfolding of a plan where two people with visions different (but similar goals) were leading. One leader was Dewey (with strong help from Kit) and the other was JS (actually Lemony who took over the job of Jacques Snicket after his death).

Quigley reported to both Kit and JS (Lemony). Whoever informed Captain W that the SB had been thrown out of the window must have been the recipient of the secret message, namely JS (Lemony). And when JS (Lemony) received the information that the Baudelaires were on the submarine (just as Quigley had received that information), JS (Lemony) sent a letter to Charles asking him to protect the Baudelaires. (Lemony deduced that the submarine would arrive close to the hotel). When Quigley sent a telegram to the submarine with a copy for Lemony, he realized that the children were going to Brinny Beach, and then asked Mr Poe to pick up the children there.

There is other evidence of this: the mysterious taxi driver. There is a very strong theory that gains more and more strength that that taxi driver in TPP is actually Lemony Snicket. In addition to talking to the children, Lemony was also eyeing the funnel. He must have deduced Dewey's plan and arranged for the SB to be recovered from the lake in front of the hotel as soon as the SB fell there. He must have contact with the help of a mysterious woman who was hiding in the trunk of the taxi. This puts Lemony on the scene of the main TPP events with the same interests that JS seems to have. What do you think of this theory?

[Dante]

I think you've reasonably demonstrated that there is a side sympathetic to the Baudelaires which wants to take them away from the hotel, in the form of Lemony; though I still contest that Lemony would by no means regard it as being in the children's interests to be taken in by Mr. Poe again, who would simply have handed them straight over to the corrupt authorities. What I don't think you've demonstrated is the necessity that Lemony - or anyone - should use the initials J.S. Either they're impersonating Jacques Snicket, a man whom everybody who matters knows is dead; or they're just using the initials at random. Siblings taking over each other's affairs aren't obliged to use that late sibling's name; or was Sally Sebald going around calling herself Gustav, and that's our new solution to that particular problem? Impersonation of specific persons has very little precedent in ASoUE in general; Kit is of the opinion that somebody is impersonating Jacques at the Hotel Denouement, but her evidence seems scanty and the narrative doesn't bear this out (however canny the Netflix series was in picking up this strand).

[FileneNGottlin]

One of the JS mentions—the one in Verbal Fridge Dialogue, or another instance with handwritten initials—could be LS, but misread. We already know that either R or Kit have sometimes confusing handwriting, so L could hypothetically look like J if written in sloppy, blurry, or otherwise unusual cursive.

[Optimism is my Phil-osophy]

Aug 30, 2020 9:43:47 GMT -5 FileneNGottlin said:

One of the JS mentions—the one in Verbal Fridge Dialogue, or another instance with handwritten initials—could be LS, but misread. We already know that either R or Kit have sometimes confusing handwriting, so L could hypothetically look like J if written in sloppy, blurry, or otherwise unusual cursive.

I think I'm going to cry ... Did someone here support me and even add a detail to my theory? Thank you!!

Aug 30, 2020 4:27:51 GMT -5 Dante said:

I think you've reasonably demonstrated that there is a side sympathetic to the Baudelaires which wants to take them away from the hotel, in the form of Lemony; though I still contest that Lemony would by no means regard it as being in the children's interests to be taken in by Mr. Poe again, who would simply have handed them straight over to the corrupt authorities. What I don't think you've demonstrated is the necessity that Lemony - or anyone - should use the initials J.S. Either they're impersonating Jacques Snicket, a man whom everybody who matters knows is dead; or they're just using the initials at random. Siblings taking over each other's affairs aren't obliged to use that late sibling's name; or was Sally Sebald going around calling herself Gustav, and that's our new solution to that particular problem? Impersonation of specific persons has very little precedent in ASoUE in general; Kit is of the opinion that somebody is impersonating Jacques at the Hotel Denouement, but her evidence seems scanty and the narrative doesn't bear this out (however canny the Netflix series was in picking up this strand).

In the case of Lemony summoning Mr Poe, I am sure it was a desperate measure, such as: "I will choose the least worst" among those who are not from VFD. I remember that my argument in favor of Beatrice being JS was that the two people she would have hypothetically chosen to protect children were people who were not from VFD. The same reasoning applies to Lemony. Lemony, unlike Kit, wanted to respect the wishes of the Baudelaires' parents not to involve them with VFD.

This concept that Baudelaire parents did not want them within the organization was subtly worked on TPP, and explicitly worked on TE, when Lemony says that the parents had never allowed them to be taken by VFD. They always answered "wind" to the code question, instead of "nothing" even on windless nights. It is important to note that Lemony knew about it, so he wrote about it. So Lemony knew about the will of her dead parents and he, out of love for Beatrice, respected her will after her death.


About Sally Sebald assuming Gustav's identity, I don't think that's the case. I believed that about two years ago when I came here. (Or something like that). But you showed me that I'm wrong using powerful arguments. Sally Sebald did not assume the identity of Gustav Sebald as she served as his representative after his death. So Gustav's death was public knowledge. (After all, he was a relatively famous person at his peak). But remember that we are talking about VFD. It may not be that common, but after writing LSTUA, Daniel Handler was full of interesting new concepts. Note, he had the idea of ​​making the Duchess of W disguise herself as Lemony Snicket. He made it possible for imposters to exist in LSTUA. He made it possible for initials to be written by others in LSTUA. So, the writing of LSTUA is another important turning point in the ASOUE universe for the degree of complexity of the plots (unfortunately very close to the end). 

So, making Lemony a secret character in TPP is easy to understand. And making him the missing JS, with the justification that he had assumed the identity of his brother (one justifying that Kit herself explicitly put on the table, including stating that this possible imposing was not necessarily a bad person) is a conclusion quite reasonable.

Dante - another detail that could make Lemony assume the identity of his brother, is that most people believed that Lemony was dead, and apparently Lemony wanted people to keep thinking that way.

[R.]

I have a rather unusual theory that JS is Esmé impersonating R impersonating Jacques Snicket. In the illustrations in TPP, we see a woman disguising herself as a man seemingly in order to sabotage an elevator. I believe that R did indeed die. The end of her letter to Lemony, ‘How content that young woman looks, don’t you think. How content, and yet how flammable’, sounds insincere and snarky, not like R at all. R also mentions that she once disguised herself as Lemony. I believe that Esmé disguised herself as R for a long time after her death, and the illustration in TPP shows Esmé disguised as R disguised as someone else, researching how to remove the elevator from 667 Dark Avenue. The reason Esmé said that JS was plotting to ruin the party but others say he/she is hosting it is because the real Jacques would try and mess up Esmé’s plans, but Esmé pretending to be Jacques was hosting the party.

[Optimism is my Phil-osophy]

I can't say that I fully understood the fundamentals of what you wrote, @ roxy222. The first question is: if R died, when did she die? I mean, the masquerade that Lemony was arrested at happened a few years after the events recorded on TRR, isn't it? Or don't you agree with that? I would like to hear your opinion, because it is a recurring subject here. In TRR, Lemony says that years had passed when Klaus was unable to sleep because of what happened to Uncle Monty. And chapter 9 of LSTUA indicates that the ball at which Lemony was arrested took place after the publication of TRR in Lemony's universe. So ... R was still alive at the time of the main events recorded in TPP. With respect to that woman disguised as a man ... I have not yet come to a conclusion about her role. She is a disguised person who has received VFD training, including wearing fake mustaches (as explained in TSS). But what did she want in the elevator? Was that the secret passage to the secret library? And why did she see two strings, one of which was about to break? Also, if I'm not mistaken, Esmé was wearing a fantastic bikini during events near the pool and also later during events related to Dewey's death. And in addition, Hal implied that he was taking the material that made up Esmé's bikini for a long time ... In addition Esmé was having a cocktail party using her own name and arranged for a reporter to interview her. I don't think she had time to do all of this while disguising herself. But I understand your interest in Esmé. I have the same interest in Beatrice. I also tried to relate that woman disguised in TPP with Beatrice.

[Optimism is my Phil-osophy]

I just remembered something important in my counter-counter argument. It is not necessarily true that many knew that Jacques was dead. Many thought that the one who had died was Count Omar. So Lemony, taking advantage of this, took responsibility for his brother and his initials.