|
Post by Isadora Is a Door on Mar 28, 2021 14:36:43 GMT -5
Edit : The Last chapter is on the previous page
Timeline of Events
1801
March 1st - Abel Snicket/Mallahan finds the watch in the mine. March 3rd - Abel dreams of his own death. A body is found in the mine. Mr. Denouement fires him. His daughter Genevieve tells him of the same dream. He completes the Bombinating Beast statue. He confronts The Beast at night, Genevieve takes the watch .
1961
March 3rd - Esme, who has inherited the watch , encounters The Beast at night. Time connects for the 3rd time. Esme sees Ellington who tells her Time has her in it's web. Esme sees her future self who tells her they all have the same end. Esme is given the notebook.
1981
Early 1981 - Beatrice Baudelaire steals the watch and the notebook from Fortuna Juvat. She gives these to Kit. February 28th - Jacques leaves Quigley at Uncle Montys March 2nd - Kit heads to Uncle Monty's, she meets with Ellington. Kit says to Ellington Time has her in it's web. They head down to the lagoon, Time connects for the 2nd time. March 3rd - Kit gives Ellington the the watch and the notebook Late 1981 - Esme is 'reborn' by The Beast and dedicates her life to Fortuna Juvat.
1982
February 28th - With the Quagmires now taken into The Beast, Quigley washes ashore and begins his work Late 1982 - The Baudelaire's leave the Island and return to the mainland
1984
February 28th - Esme encounters Quigley in the tunnels and recruits him to Fortuna Juvat.
1991
Beatrice is separated from Violet, Klaus, and Sunny
2000
Beatrice meets Lemony Snicket
2001
March 1st - Ellington and Lemony venture into the lagoon and encounter The Beast. Time connects for the 1st time. March 2nd - Ellington and Lemony attempt to sneak into Fortuna Juvat but are captured by Esme March 3rd - Esme takes the watch and the notebook from Ellington. Esme tells Ellington they all have the same end. Ellington leaves Lemony, who begins to dedicate his life to tracking The Beast
2002
February 28th - Quigley makes contact with Lemony, and they begin working on the map.
2003
February 28th - Quigley and Lemony continue to work on the map.
2009
Esme makes contact with Beatrice. Esme eventually gives Beatrice the watch
2016
March 1st - Beatrice finds Lemony, they head into Fortuna Juvat. Beatrice sacrifices Lemony. Time connects for the 1st time March 2nd - Esme places the watch on Lemony's body. Esme tells Beatrice Time has her in it's web. March 3rd - Esme tells Beatrice they all have the same end. Beatrice takes the notebook and pushes Esme into the jaws of The Beast
2017
February 28th - Fortuna Juvat disbands
2021
February 28th - Quigley has retrieved the watch from the police. He gives it to Beatrice. March 1st - Beatrice makes Contact with Daniel Handler. They head to the sewers, and Time connects for the 1st time March 2nd - Beatrice sacrifices Daniel. Time connects for the 2nd time. The city is destroyed in a wave of Ink, Beatrice and Quigley survive in the tunnels.
2026 March 2nd - Beatrice in the Abandoned House. Time connects for the 2nd time March 3rd - Ellington meets Beatrice. Beatrice tells Ellington Time has her in it's web. Ellington tells Beatrice. they all have the same end. Esme joins them both. Time connects for the 3rd time. Ellington tells young Esme Time has her in it's web. Esme tells her past self that they all have the same end. Young Esme is given the notebook. Armstrong takes Ellington into The Beast.
20??
March 3rd - Time connects for the 3rd time
2031
Beatrice gives Quigley the watch .
2052
February 28th - Quigley dies.
|
|
|
Post by Isadora Is a Door on Mar 28, 2021 14:47:52 GMT -5
Was the destruction of the City intentional and if so, why was it necessary? Yeah that's something I don't feel inclined to answer, as I think whatever the reader feels is the answer is the correct one. And I'll be happy to reread it. My hope is that this is a story that will merit re-reading. Hopefully now you understand how she knew everything that would happen? (We have a bootstrap paradox on her hands.) You made the assumption that it could be a body from another time. This could be correct, it could not be; There is lots to unpick from the 1801 chapter. It is unknown. To examine it any depth would have lost the mystery around that, but I do have specific rules and logic around how it works. Though it doesn't answer your questions directly perhaps it hints more as to where I was coming from with it It's blood.
|
|
|
Post by R. on Mar 28, 2021 23:55:32 GMT -5
I interpreted the Black Ink as being the ink that the story itself, the Snicketverse, was printed on. After all, ASOUE and ATWQ are just books after all, and the entire world within them is formed of printer’s ink. This is why it can connect time etc. It is the fundamental force, the element, that all of space and time in the Snicketverse is formed of. That’s why it floods the city after Daniel Handler’s death; the world is becoming unstable after the death of its creator.
|
|
|
Black Ink
Mar 29, 2021 2:49:03 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Mar 29, 2021 2:49:03 GMT -5
I interpreted the Black Ink as being the ink that the story itself, the Snicketverse, was printed on. After all, ASOUE and ATWQ are just books after all, and the entire world within them is formed of printer’s ink. This is why it can connect time etc. It is the fundamental force, the element, that all of space and time in the Snicketverse is formed of. That’s why it floods the city after Daniel Handler’s death; the world is becoming unstable after the death of its creator. I have tears in my eyes. The most perfect allegorical interpretation I have ever seen.It is the blood of history, so to speak. Congratulations Roxy222. I think you discern an important element of the story.
|
|
|
Post by Isadora Is a Door on Mar 29, 2021 15:45:07 GMT -5
I interpreted the Black Ink as being the ink that the story itself, the Snicketverse, was printed on. After all, ASOUE and ATWQ are just books after all, and the entire world within them is formed of printer’s ink. This is why it can connect time etc. It is the fundamental force, the element, that all of space and time in the Snicketverse is formed of. That’s why it floods the city after Daniel Handler’s death; the world is becoming unstable after the death of its creator. Cool
|
|
|
Post by Dante on Mar 30, 2021 6:09:30 GMT -5
I see. This is a story about obsession with the past and how it can consume you. The characters in the story are trapped and unable to move on from their fixation with events in their history; the loss of their family, or a vision of their own potential, or a hint of a secret. Rather than living their life on their own terms and approaching the future with an open mind, all they can think to do is attempt to recreate past conditions, without really understanding why or how this will help them, as if just by revisiting the past then their future will be fixed. They seek to turn their whole lives into an ourobouros, a snake biting its tail, an endless loop, repeating... The black ink is the blood of the Great Unknown, but it's also time; and when the characters are surrendering their time to this quest of futility, they are necessarily also surrendering their lives. Life, time - they intertwine in this story like the snakes around a caduceus. But in the end, there is no evil in time itself, in the Great Unknown; only in the things people do in its name. The deeper their fanaticism, the more is destroyed.
The metaphor is thus: If you let it, the past will destroy you. Eventually, you have to move on.
|
|
|
Black Ink
Mar 30, 2021 7:47:09 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Mar 30, 2021 7:47:09 GMT -5
Yes it is true. Esmé had more reasons than anyone to stick to the past, but she still had a great desire to move on. She is a notorious character here.
|
|
|
Post by Isadora Is a Door on Mar 30, 2021 12:42:29 GMT -5
I see. This is a story about obsession with the past and how it can consume you. The characters in the story are trapped and unable to move on from their fixation with events in their history; the loss of their family, or a vision of their own potential, or a hint of a secret. Rather than living their life on their own terms and approaching the future with an open mind, all they can think to do is attempt to recreate past conditions, without really understanding why or how this will help them, as if just by revisiting the past then their future will be fixed. They seek to turn their whole lives into an ourobouros, a snake biting its tail, an endless loop, repeating... The black ink is the blood of the Great Unknown, but it's also time; and when the characters are surrendering their time to this quest of futility, they are necessarily also surrendering their lives. Life, time - they intertwine in this story like the snakes around a caduceus. But in the end, there is no evil in time itself, in the Great Unknown; only in the things people do in its name. The deeper their fanaticism, the more is destroyed. The metaphor is thus: If you let it, the past will destroy you. Eventually, you have to move on. Beautifully put. This a wonderful summation of my intentions. I wonder though, what people think about the role of Ellington. Ellington was the only one who didn't want to be reunited with those she had lost, but in the end she is the only one who was.
|
|
|
Black Ink
Mar 30, 2021 13:32:54 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Mar 30, 2021 13:32:54 GMT -5
Well ... This is true ... I think that because Eligton is an ATWQ character, no matter how much we strive to give the same importance as the characters of asoue, our subconscious is more affectionate with the characters of asoue. .. It is not intentional. Looking back, I didn't feel excited about Eligton's journey or the outcome of it. And it is not Mister M's fault, but I think it is because there are so many characters with whom I cling more strongly that Eligton must have been left out.
|
|
|
Post by Isadora Is a Door on Mar 31, 2021 2:49:36 GMT -5
Well ... This is true ... I think that because Eligton is an ATWQ character, no matter how much we strive to give the same importance as the characters of asoue, our subconscious is more affectionate with the characters of asoue. Indeed. So the character we have less attachment too achieves the aims that our central character (Beatrice) was unable to achieve.
|
|
|
Post by Optimism is my Phil-osophy on Apr 1, 2021 16:31:37 GMT -5
Now that I understand why the beast changes in size ... This is a justification for the fact that in ATWQ the beast looked smaller than in asoue. Canonically the justification seems to be that it is the fact that the beast is young. But in Black Ink, the beast simply changes size according to your perspective.
|
|
|
Post by Christmas Chief on Apr 5, 2021 10:53:23 GMT -5
Well, I was planning to catch up this upcoming weekend, but after hearing so many rave reviews I decided it couldn't wait another day. Disclaimer that I haven't read any part of this thread past page 2. Will be commenting on comments as I go along, beginning with March 1st 2016 - "Beatrice and Lemony had been walking ..." Tension, mystery - I can easily picture this scene in a movie, especially this part: True: Characters need to be audacious to get what they want. The concept of audacity is a little difficult, but when we see it we identify it. It doesn't mean to be reckless, but I would say it's the position to stand around waiting for things to change. And Beatrice Jr is the avatar of audacity here. I'm not sure I'd call the characters audacious at this point - perhaps ambitious? March 1st 2021 - "Darkness was beginning to consume the world ..." So are Daniel and Lemony different characters? ... Yes, it seems they are. Hmm. Also, I like how you've portrayed the older Beatrice's increased experience in the world. She's leading Daniel now, whereas years ago Daniel's friend(?) was leading her.
|
|
|
Post by Christmas Chief on Apr 5, 2021 13:45:38 GMT -5
March 1st 2001 - "The stretch of road that leads out of Hazy Harbor ..." Ellington! Great portrayal of her character - it's both true to ATWQ and makes sense within the world of the story. So how are the Beast and the Great Unknown related, if they are related at all? I liked this line from Lemony. Also very true to character: honest, sad, but a little bit funny, too. Meeting with dead people ... Would this be a journey through the dead? I don't think Lemony is dead at this point, is he? It's 2001. March 1st 2016 - "Beatrice watched as Lemony examined the door ..." Very Snickety line! Oh - 667 . I wonder if this will be the 667 or our 667. *looks up "ankh"* WHAT? Beatrice is collaborating with Esme?! March 1st 2001 - "It didn't begin with my father ..." Mmm. We learn more about the history of the pocketwatch, though not its nature, yet. Is this a threat? March 1st 2021 - "Daniel could feel his heart hammering in his chest ..." Ha! I suspected that there would be time travel, but did not expect this kind of time travel. The inky-time-mist reminds me of a Potteresque Pensieve, except the past and present can interact with each other. Hmm. I don't totally follow the time convergence, but trust your comment: Time will tell, it always does. March 2nd 2026 - "The Hinterlands had become a wild and barren place ..." The map's significance becomes more clear as a tool for mapping time as well as place. Beatrice is friends with the Beast, here in the distant future. March 2nd 1981 - "The stretch of road that leads out of the city ..." Ellington again! And she knows Kit. It's interesting to see her intersect with the background of the Baudelaires' story. March 2nd 2001 - "Ellington looked at the Golden pocket watch ..." Hmm. I'm not sure how the watch works, but I'm curious to find out. March 2nd 2016 - "Beatrice was not sure how long she had slept ..." !!! Esme drinks the inky black liquid - so it's not just Beast material. Wow. I can't believe Beatrice killed Lemony just to see the Baudelaires again. Great Esme line. March 2nd 2021 - "It was late afternoon at Briny Beach ..." Ah, so we learn why the sacrifice was necessary. The Baudelaires were taken by the Beast. So are the Beast and the Great Unknown one and the same? February 28th 1981 - the Quigley chapter Quigley, too, is working for Esme. But why? I suspect this theme will reappear. March 2nd 1981An intriguing exchange. Ellington's motives are as clear and consistent as ever (or are they?).
|
|
|
Post by Isadora Is a Door on Apr 5, 2021 15:48:59 GMT -5
You binge-reading my fic is truly beautiful to read.
|
|
|
Post by Christmas Chief on Apr 6, 2021 9:33:34 GMT -5
March 2nd 2021 - "Daniel pushed the door to his apartment closed ..." There is something so fitting about Daniel Handler being attacked in his apartment by the characters he created. So the black liquid enables the time travel? March 3rd 1801 - "When Abel had woken ..." A new character? "Dreams were meant for lesser people" - ouch. I like how "Mr. Denouement" plays on the ambiguity of the triplets. Oh no - Abel is in and out so quickly. March 3rd 2026 - "She could see the ruins of the city ..." No, Beatrice, you KILLED the people who were willing to help you. Oh no - what happened to Quigley? Good Ellington line. March 3rd 2001 - "Ellington was not sure how long she had slept ..." Reading this line from a calm and in-control Esme gives her character a whole new flavor. March 3rd 2016 - "Beatrice and Esme were in the main atrium ..." ! Beatrice, no! Not again! March 3rd 1981 - "Kit took a sip of coffee..." Someone needs to have this conversation with Beatrice. Kit gives Ellington the watch and notebook to keep hidden, though we still don't know the full significance of each. March 3rd 2001 - "Ellington sat across from Lemony ..." Lemony wants to find the Baudelaires, and Ellington wants to find the truth ... whatever that may be. The ankh holds the key to the iron door. Two chapters remain. How many questions will they answer? March 3rd 1961 - "As her eyes opened she found herself surrounded in darkness..." Esme is called by the Beast. Does it have her under a trance? Does she know what it is? March 3rd 2026 - "Beatrice reached out to the Beast ..." Good point. The Beast is not the Great Unknown, it seems, since Esme distinguishes them. Beatrice was tricked - but why? Hangfire and Esme reappear - but how? Ellington disappears into the Beast with her father. It's possible the timeline will help with some of these questions. In the meantime, great work, Isadora Is a Door! This was an ambitious fic to be sure, and you explored so many fascinating facets of the Averse with it.
|
|