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Post by Dante on Sept 3, 2022 15:54:30 GMT -5
Imagine the following scenario: A fan of the ASOUE books and passionate about cinema watched some episodes of the first season of the Netflix Series. He hated what he saw. He dropped out of the series after the second episode, giving various justifications like Sunny's bad CG, Count Olaf's musical spectacle, and the like. What arguments would you use to helpelp him to give the Netflix series another chance? Your goal should be to get him to at least watch a few episodes or scenes and improve his overall concept of the show. (He doesn't have to fall in love with the series).
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Post by S. on Sept 3, 2022 17:38:11 GMT -5
I would ask for their favorite scenes from the books. Show them the adaptation of each scene.
Another method would be to show them parts that aren't shown in the books, like all the flashbacks regarding VFD.
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Post by 熊 on Sept 7, 2022 6:46:40 GMT -5
lol, is this scenario based on me in any way ? If so, I’ll have you know i watched the whole first season (twice) and I had better complaints than “fake sunny”
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Post by Dante on Sept 7, 2022 11:24:15 GMT -5
Your opinion is really valuable 熊. Being a fan of movies and series in general and also a connoisseur of the original work, how would you turn the first season into something really good from your point of view? What would you take out and what would you put in? Of course, what would you do to still be accessible to the project's target audience? |
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Post by 熊 on Sept 7, 2022 13:05:14 GMT -5
i'm not a fan of TV in general, although i do think ASOUE has higher than average potential to make a good TV show, insofar as a TV show can be good, because of the books' formulaic nature and, later on, the VFD story arc and cliffhanger endings.
one thing TV had the potential to do, but didn't, is give proportional time to each book according to its length and complexity. DH may not have thought of VFD when he was writing the first books, and he may later have wished it had more presence from the beginning of the story, but he has also said that he consciously wanted the books to be more chaotic as the series progressed. a major part of the delight of ASOUE is the way it gradually explodes from a quaint gothic pastiche to a labyrinthine world of conspiracy, mystery, and fantasy. the TV show, by giving 2 episodes to each book, has plenty of space to fill from the start, and launches us immediately into madcap action, extra VFD characters, and (what the hell?) musical numbers, already hammering in the notion that we've entered a zany, exciting world.
but even if all the superfluous plot were taken out, i'd continue to hate the bubbly 60s aesthetic that is the basis of the show. brett helquist did not randomly invent the idea of a gothic ASOUE. it's the entire premise of the early books. it's why the narrator is comically grim, why every title and placename has some Woeful Wordplay, why there are characters called Baudelaire and Poe, and why there are three orphans and an evil count, in the first place. in the show, i saw nothing remotely gothic outside of olaf's house. it's true that by the end of the books, they've grown far from their gothic roots -- that should be the end point, not the starting point. i'm raising the same issue of allowing the series to establish its basic shtick, establish a formula, and THEN spiral out of control.
on the subject of the target audience, i believe humor is the most important way to cross audience boundaries, and one of the things i objected to most was the show's humor. it made me cringe, and it wasn't "cringe humor" it was just terrible jokes, and there's no way children would find them funny either. i believe the real target audience for the netflix show to be people who grew up reading ASOUE who are now adults. i do not want to hear a James Brown reference in ASOUE, for instance. too many wordy, cringey, dorky jokes. jim carrey pretending to be a dinosaur -- now that's fukkin funny, and just as funny now as it was when i was 6. of course, there is buffoonish humor too, but poorly done, which brings me to my last amendment: overhaul the entire putrid cast, especially g.d. m.f. NPH, and get some proper powerful FILM actors in there. there's nothing doing about the kids, though. they're a dead loss no matter what, with the only workaround being (as i've mentioned before, and it's still my favorite idea) an animated version.
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Post by urban-letter-opener on Sept 7, 2022 13:33:03 GMT -5
Just as soon as 熊 directs his own version of the Netflix series, your problem is solved, Jean. |
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Post by MARLOWE !!!!! on Sept 7, 2022 23:41:47 GMT -5
"im goff" - bear it's why the narrator is comically grim, why every title and placename has some Woeful Wordplay, why there are characters called Baudelaire and Poe, and why there are three orphans and an evil count, in the first place. in the show, i saw nothing remotely gothic outside of olaf's house. it's true that by the end of the books, they've grown far from their gothic roots --
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Post by Dante on Sept 8, 2022 12:20:39 GMT -5
Well, against facts there is no argument... However, I think in the first season the TRR adaptation is good enough. I think in the second season the TAA adaptation is particularly good. And in the third season, the adaptation of TSS is also very good. (with the exception of a specific scene involving Esmé that I didn't like and the death of certain characters). I think if you watched it, you could at least understand why the series had such devoted fans, even people who have never read the books.
ps.: Of course, people are bear s and that's a good reason there are fans of so many bad things, but I'm not talking about that.
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Post by Lemona on Sept 8, 2022 14:53:41 GMT -5
I also don't like the netflix series, and gave up during the second series.
It's odd that I find myself agreeing so much with bear.
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Post by Dante on Sept 9, 2022 9:34:45 GMT -5
熊 pointed out facts, there's no way to disagree with him. The thing is, despite the problems there must be something good, right?
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Post by Lemona on Sept 9, 2022 9:37:10 GMT -5
My issue is that the books are better, far too much better, and so I would rather read those.
I also felt a bit that, especially the second series, the show was corrupting my images of the books that I have had in my head sine I was a child. I don't mind when that happens if the images are better or superior, but these images were not good.
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Post by Tiran O'Saurus on Sept 9, 2022 10:07:34 GMT -5
My issue is that the books are better, far too much better, and so I would rather read those. I also felt a bit that, especially the second series, the show was corrupting my images of the books that I have had in my head sine I was a child. I don't mind when that happens if the images are better or superior, but these images were not good. I agree about the images. When I reread THH and saw Helquist's illustration of Heimlich Hospital as a gothic, Victorian building, I was surprised. The falling apart, industrial building from the show had gotten to me. Similarly, I keep forgetting that Gunther had a monocle, or that Genghis didn't have a Forrest Gump voice, or that Dupin didn't always say "sca dupida dupida doopity blippity bang". |
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Post by Dante on Sept 9, 2022 12:20:04 GMT -5
Well, I wanted to help someone who didn't like the Netflix show to like it, but you guys are making me stop liking it.
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Post by Strangely on Sept 9, 2022 13:45:41 GMT -5
Imagine the following scenario: A fan of the ASOUE books and passionate about cinema watched some episodes of the first season of the Netflix Series. He hated what he saw. He dropped out of the series after the second episode, giving various justifications like Sunny's bad CG, Count Olaf's musical spectacle, and the like. What arguments would you use to helpelp him to give the Netflix series another chance? Your goal should be to get him to at least watch a few episodes or scenes and improve his overall concept of the show. (He doesn't have to fall in love with the series). I don't know that I'd try to convince them to watch it again, it seems like its just not their cup of tea. I get that you want them to enjoy it like you do, but sometimes that's just not possible. And that's fair. The show is an interpretation of the books, colored by the experiences and tastes of the people who made it. Even though we're all reading the same book we're all walking away with a different vision of it in our head. As such there's no guarantee that you'll relate to the show in the same way as you do the books. Personally I like the Netflix show, I like the 1960's aesthetic. I like Muppet Sunny and the goofy looking CGI and I have a soft spot for musicals. I enjoy the Netflix show for reasons completely separate from the books. And if someone doesn't like it, I'm perfectly fine with that. Everyone is different, with different standards and different experiences, so I think it's completely fair for people to passionately hate the Netflix show should they choose. In the end, it's not possible to make something that works perfectly for everyone. Enjoy it yourself and maybe one day they'll come around on it, or perhaps they won't. Don't let other people's opinions ruin your enjoyment of it. |
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Post by Tiran O'Saurus on Sept 12, 2022 10:06:44 GMT -5
Personally, I think that the show is generally good, but it has its flaws. However, "It's the Count" is not one of them. That song was awesome. If this person doesn't think so, they're beyond redemption.
(Joking)
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