The 667 Dark Avenue Re-Read 2012

[Christmas Chief]

I've started preparing notes on TSS; I'm only waiting for your official initiation, MisterM.

[MisterM]

Well, If you're re-read ready, i will post my notes tomorrow morning.

[ironic impostor]

Hooray!

[MisterM]

--Chapter One--

So Here we are at the start of my favourite book in the series. This was the third Unfortunate Events book I read. Well, no, that’s not correct, it was the third book I heard. Many years ago, I received the audiotape of TSS as a birthday present, and I listened to it on repeat for years. I know the book almost word for word. I know every line, every scene, and every joke. But I love it. It think its clever, funny, sad, and upsetting all at once, and mostly at the same time.
And, although I was originally unsure of the year, It must have been around 2004, because I remember seeing movie posters for the ASOUE film at the time I first got the audiotape.

I like the comparison of the book to a dead poet. Nice and cheerful as always, lemony

This book is really just a detour. The Baudelaires end up more or less where they started.

Lemony says he would rather not speak about the animals at all. But surely Snow Gnats are insects? Or is this a reference to the VFelineDetectives?

I love the description of Count Olaf. Makes me laugh every time.

The way it is said that Olaf had managed to attract a girlfriend makes it seem very recent, although surely that doesn’t add up with TUA. Although nothing really adds up with TUA…

And so having shed the disguise, Violet should still be in her hospital gown. I suppose it doesn’t have to be mentioned, but Helliquests illustration is therefore inaccurate…

I learned so many things from this book, like what a drag chute is.

Ah, the famous pantry list. Time for a game. I’m going to try to write down as many as I can remember, and see how close I was. Ones I forgot will be added in italics.
Blackstrap Molasses, Wild clover honey, corned syrup, aged balsamic vinegar, apple butter , strawberry jam, caramel sauce, maple syrup, butterscotch toffee, maraschino lequre, virgin and extra virgin olive oil, lemon curd, dried apricots, mango chutney, crema de nochi, Tamarind paste, hot mustard, marshmallows, creamd corn, peanut butter, grape preserves, salt Water taffy , contended milk . pumpkin pie filling, and glue.
Well, not to bad!

The moment when the Baudelaires look outside is chilling. I ca picture it so well and then Klaus saying he needs to tell violet something, also sends chills down my spine And Violet using the table as a break is such a heroic moment almost. If anything, this moment is something I would love to see on film. In fact, the whole book would be great as a film.

Valley of Four Drafts - Coincidence, or was it named so by VFD?

And realised just how fortunate they have been - is this one of the few times the word fortunate is used in the series?

It took me several read/listens to realise the ash made the fish ’cough’ even though it is said by Klaus at some point.

The Caravan falling of the peak makes me so upset… And it leads to my favourite line in the entire series ‘It is difficult when face with a situation you cannot control, to admit you can do nothing. That the caravan is never found only adds to the spookiness of the caravans ‘demise’ the muffled boom being incredibly sinister. And this is the start of us not getting all the answers we want. Although, in the end it doesn’t matter.

‘some of my questions will never be answered’ - well I hope he asked the right ones

[Teleram]

My notes for TSS will probably be ready in a few days.

[MisterM]

Chapter Two

Does Klaus really think he can catch up with Olaf? He already has a head start on the Baudelaires, and even if they can make ‘some sort of vehicle’ they will still have trouble catching up with him?

Pulling aside a bearskin rug - Resembling Quigley’s escape.

The Bread Knife is the ultimate Chekov’s gun here. Every time Violet fells it in her pocket, I get a moment of anticipation, even though I know she wont use it yet.

Well done Daniel, all the elements from previous books that turn up later in this one are mentioned here, in case you’d forgotten them!

I know I’m probably boring you all with ‘this should be a film’, but I also have a soundtrack to the book. Its not actual music, I can just imagine the music coming in during the scene when Violet asks Klaus what he was going to say

There might be an ink factory nearby - it would be cool if that was the real reason (Another branch of Ink Inc?). After all, how did the ash get in the river of its frozen waterfall?

The reference to Mr Poe - I have the feeling Handler had finished with Mr Poe at this point in the story, but maybe imp wrong.
Although, The BBRE was released around this time, yes? (Dante?), so maybe he did have more plans for Poe.

Which parent do you think is the survivor - at this point in the story, I (and my nan when I read the books to her a couple of years back) both thought the father would be alive. I don’t know why, but when I asked my Nan why she thought that she said ‘well, their mother is Beatrice, and lemony been saying shes dead for 10 books.’

The motorcycle helmet echoes TVV.

After they are reunited with their baby sister - oh yeah, way to spoil it lemony.

Carmelita is back! I enjoyed her in book 5, and in this book. But after this, Carmelita is just…. Plain annoying. Not even funny.

[Charlie]

dude don't diss her she's a ball-playing cowboy pirate something something something. Like sreiously, you can't mess with those guys

[Dante]

Apr 16, 2013 4:26:43 GMT -5 MisterM said:

The Bread Knife is the ultimate Chekov’s gun here. Every time Violet fells it in her pocket, I get a moment of anticipation, even though I know she wont use it yet.

Yes, last time I reread TSS, I remember being quite pleased with how it kept on being hinted at, but then it's finally used in a totally non-violent way. Excellent.

Well done Daniel, all the elements from previous books that turn up later in this one are mentioned here, in case you’d forgotten them!

Successive Chapter Ones in the later books tend to generally combine minimal plot with an element of summary of previous books. It's a bit of a jump forward, but people successfully guessed that Jerome Squalor and Justice Strauss would be in TPP from their being mentioned in the first chapter of that book.

There might be an ink factory nearby - it would be cool if that was the real reason (Another branch of Ink Inc?). After all, how did the ash get in the river of its frozen waterfall?

Probably the incinerated complex built right next to the river would've done the trick in that regard. I vaguely recall a suggestion, also, that the heat from the fire might've melted the river temporarily before False Spring, and that's how it became so clouded with ash rather than the ash just settling on the ice?

The reference to Mr Poe - I have the feeling Handler had finished with Mr Poe at this point in the story, but maybe imp wrong.
Although, The BBRE was released around this time, yes? (Dante?), so maybe he did have more plans for Poe.

As far as I'm aware, TSS and the BBRE were released in proximity to one another, yes. It's surprisingly hard to reliably determine the release dates of books from just a few years ago, well and truly in the age of the web, but they may even have been released on the same day.

Which parent do you think is the survivor - at this point in the story, I (and my nan when I read the books to her a couple of years back) both thought the father would be alive. I don’t know why, but when I asked my Nan why she thought that she said ‘well, their mother is Beatrice, and lemony been saying shes dead for 10 books.’

On the other hand, a commonly-cited point is a statement at the end of TSS by Lemony that the Baudelaires' father is dead. The general consensus, I think, was that Beatrice was far more interesting.

After they are reunited with their baby sister - oh yeah, way to spoil it lemony.

Lemony spoils quite a few details now and then, if you want to put it that way, but only things that create tension to know in advance or which you know will happen anyway. There was never any way Sunny was going to remain separated from her siblings all the way into the following book.

Carmelita is back! I enjoyed her in book 5, and in this book. But after this, Carmelita is just…. Plain annoying. Not even funny.

I have to agree; the promise of Carmelita in TSS is somewhat wasted. It's suggested - I'm aware I'm leaping forward in chapters again - that she'll be a sort of equal partner in evil to Esmé and Olaf, but then in the following book he can't stand her and she ends up driving him and Esmé apart. Doubtless this change of use for her in TGG was precisely to set up the eventual departure of Esmé, but it's still kind of annoying.

[MisterM]

It's a bit of a jump forward, but people successfully guessed that Jerome Squalor and Justice Strauss would be in TPP from their being mentioned in the first chapter of that book.

Which was apparently released as a preview, I believe? I wuld love to see what people speculated from that chapter. Especially the stuff about the opera thing.

I vaguely recall a suggestion, also, that the heat from the fire might've melted the river temporarily before False Spring, and that's how it became so clouded with ash rather than the ash just settling on the ice?

Hm. I get the impression the fire had only just taken place, shortly before Olaf and co. reach the peak. Surely the waterfall couldn’t re-freeze that quickly? Although tere is a whole separate issue there, as to what the sinister duo where actually doing before they arrive in Chapter six. More on that when we get there.

The general consensus, I think, was that Beatrice was far more interesting

Well, yes, certainly. But I am rather interested in Bertrand, as should become clear in TBL. And also, that’s why he is included, albeit only briefly in my Fanfic, because he is even more of a mustery than Beatrice.

There was never any way Sunny was going to remain separated from her siblings all the way into the following book

Well, that is true. But the idea of the Baudilares being separated for more than book ahs always interested me. Once again, see my Fanfic....

but then in the following book he can't stand her and she ends up driving him and Esmé apart. Doubtless this change of use for her in TGG was precisely to set up the eventual departure of Esmé, but it's still kind of annoying.

Her various ludicrous costumes are the most annoying thing, however. As Charlie said

dude don't diss her she's a ball-playing cowboy pirate something something something.

Chapter Three

Due to the split nature of this book, I recall reading TSS in this way once
C1, C2, C4, C5, C7, C8, C10 and C12, and then C3, C6, C9, C11 and C13 (I’m pretty sure that’s correct), and the story still worked and made complete sense. I’m quite tempted to do that again at some point.

Esme pinching Sunny seems unnecessarily cruel, but it just seems silly to believe pinching someone would make them stop crying…

I tried to explain to the volunteers that crime is very in right now - Er… when? This seems rather strange and isn’t referred to again.

Oh, and early reference to child servants from Esme here

Is there an In hotel - Er, Esme, we’re in the middle of a mountain range.

The Slippery Slope itself is curious especially in the description in this chapter.

Six people in one tent… lets hope they’re not to small. Fernalds hooks might hurt.

It would have been better if we had read Olaf talking about the gnats before we saw them, I feel. C1, C3, and then C2?

[Dante]

Apr 17, 2013 13:06:58 GMT -5 MisterM said:

Which was apparently released as a preview, I believe? I wuld love to see what people speculated from that chapter. Especially the stuff about the opera thing.

There wasn't very much time to do so, unfortunately; the chapter was released on the very day the book was published.

I tried to explain to the volunteers that crime is very in right now - Er… when? This seems rather strange and isn’t referred to again.

I assumed it referred to an incident far in the past.

[MisterM]

More notes soon, i promise

[MisterM]

-Chapter Four--

I wonder if anyone worked out who Uncle Bruce was before his identity is revealed?

Of course, if the Baudelaires continue on, they would reach the smell of smoke from the ruined VFD headquarters….

The Pledge is Another long list, yet again hiking up the page count of the book.

And of course, did anyway work out who Quigley was?

I don’t actually know what Xenial means…

-- Chapter Five---

Bruce ‘has caused VFD enough trouble’. And Quigley knows this how?

Ah. I should know what xenial means… funny I forgot that…

A closely guarded secret… but surely it wouldn’t be that difficult to stumble upon, especially if there used to be a pole there?

And speaking of the pole. It is, of course, moved to the quietude

And… the letter to kit. I don’t really know how to make this work in-story. It would be better if there was indication that the letter was written a long while ago, but had just been added in? No, that doesn’t work. Any theories anyone?

And of course, what does the sugar bowl contain? What evidence? Could the Brominating Beast be a possibility? I’d like to think so. Lemony is clearly very involved with the statue, so maybe… that’s inside the sugar bowl?

[Dante]

Bruce is a very obscure character in the series, so I'd be surprised if many people remembered him before the end of the book. As to guessing who Quigley is, though - my recollection of the book is that there isn't much reason to conclude it's him before his identity is revealed, although he is wearing an identical sweater and carrying an identical commonplace book to his siblings, as I recall it. So you'd connect him to them, and the back cover synopsis might then lead you to connect those clues to Quigley, but it'd depend on whether you were anticipating the twist or not.

As for the letter to Kit, the best you can do is the solution we've settled upon for a while, that Snicket rushed out very early reports on the Baudelaires which contained the letters, and only later revised them into the full editions we possess, which kept the original material such as the letter to Kit despite the fact that he knew she was dead. Although he might not have, you know. It would've been at least a year until he could have known.

As for the sugar bowl, I'm certain it must have originally been planned to contain evidence that would - well, as TSS says, indict Olaf and exonerate Lemony. But in TPP it seems to stand for something greater.

Edit: Can't be the Bombinating Beast, though. I wonder, sometimes - do people actually know how big a sugar bowl is? I've seen theories and read fics that seem to picture them as being barrel-sized. Sugar bowls are usually about as big as your clenched fist. A milk-bottle-sized statue is not going in there. (Fig. 1)

[MisterM]

--Chapter Six--

And this is the same Harpoon gun as in TVV? I cant see why not…

I love the scenes with the troupe in this chapter. The tone is perfect. They are funny, but not to funny. In the last chapter they are almost to comical to be believable, but here they are pitched perfectly.

Why don’t the WFW just not put powder over their faces? I have an idea.. Maybe they have some sort of scar on their faces. Maybe from a fire, perhaps?

I’m quite interested about the snowsuit - when it was stolen from, presumably, Beatrice, and why.

I seem to recall at some point in my youth attempting to make toast with jam spread in the shape of an eye. I think it was quite the disaster

One of the white-faced women glanced at Sunny and gave her a small smile - I love the story of The White faced Women. Its certainly interesting how kind they are to sunny, even though they are her captors.

The introduction of the sinister duo is superb. Its one of the few moments in the series I think would be better on screen than on page. And also, it has only just occurred to me that the sinister duo is not a name ever mentioned in the books, but something I believe Dante came up with (if the old re-read is correct). I have always referred to them as the sinister duo, even in real life, so, thanks Dante!

The Sinister Duo, are, of course, the true evil of the series. Olaf is so easily undermined in this passage - he is scared of them. And if the villain for the last 10 or so books is scared then, well….

Surely we had true confirmation here? ‘Before the schism… that is a long time ago’

So… how big were the headquarters??

The swimming pool being burnt down. J

So..how long have the Sinister Duo been burning down the headquarters terms with the rest fo the series. I like to think around the time of the end of TAA. Maybe Oafs original plans with the quagmires (I.e taking them out of the city) involved the sinister duo, but when they left to burn the headquarters, he had to go back into the city for some reason?

‘its almost as if they knew we were coming’ - I find this chilling because… how were they warned?

Is this figurine the bombinating beast? Well, that would scupper my sugar bowl theory.

Fernald doesn’t recognize the sinister duo, which is… odd

--Chapter Seven--

Wow, its taken a month to get trough the first seven chapters… I will finish this book this week though. Promise!

Its reveals like Quigley having the VFDevices, and that they are the same thing esme has just been given in the pervious chapter that makes this books so clever.

You can also see the VFDevices on Bertrand’s desk in the UE movie, if you look closely!

The precise wording is strange ‘we might walk in on the entire organization having breakfast’ - Do the Baudelaires really expect the entire organization to be here?

The VFDoor fits over the doorknob? Really? I don’t remember that. The chapter illustration gives the impression its much bigger than that…

The telegram never arrived - Well… surely it did? But it was just ignored by Mr Poe, correct? And how can Quigley know this?

A broken cuff-link - well, we offered you more…

I have a theory about... well. you'll see. It just needs longer to.. develop.

[Dante]

May 6, 2013 11:40:12 GMT -5 MisterM said:

And this is the same Harpoon gun as in TVV? I cant see why not…

It's easy to see how it could be the harpoon gun from TVV - the same gun turning up in TPP, restocked with harpoons, is maybe a little more difficult. Maybe Olaf ditched his car and everything in it owing to the end of the book, and the volunteers went rifling through his boot?

I love the scenes with the troupe in this chapter. The tone is perfect. They are funny, but not to funny. In the last chapter they are almost to comical to be believable, but here they are pitched perfectly.

One of the highlights for me of the books in The Dilemma Deepens is its use of the troupe. Getting to hear from them as actual characters with personalities interacting with each other is fantastic, and very entertaining.

Why don’t the WFW just not put powder over their faces? I have an idea.. Maybe they have some sort of scar on their faces. Maybe from a fire, perhaps?

I'd say they were in mourning, but putting white powder on your face isn't nearly as big a mourning tradition as, say, wearing black. I think the scar theory is better, though - as the rest of TSS demonstrates, they're far more interesting with a tragic backstory, as opposed to two of the three freaks, who have nothing wrong with them and as such can't really be taken seriously.

One of the white-faced women glanced at Sunny and gave her a small smile - I love the story of The White faced Women. Its certainly interesting how kind they are to sunny, even though they are her captors.

You can see them thawing throughout TSS. I imagine they never before then really regarded any of the Baudelaires, much less the smallest and least conspicuous, as real individuals who they were threatening. Olaf's treatment of a baby in such a tyrannical manner was a step too far for them - or rather, it made them aware of how far they had come from their roots, and how much they regretted it.

The introduction of the sinister duo is superb. Its one of the few moments in the series I think would be better on screen than on page. And also, it has only just occurred to me that the sinister duo is not a name ever mentioned in the books, but something I believe Dante came up with (if the old re-read is correct). I have always referred to them as the sinister duo, even in real life, so, thanks Dante!

Well, we just needed a good and snappy name for them. I'm not totally positive I came up with the name "the sinister duo," but it's evidently stuck, and for a good reason. But as to their actual introduction, I think it's up there as one of the best moments in the entire series. Even the way it's arranged on the page is perfect - we hear their first line at the bottom of a right-hand page, and it feels like the narrative is taking a deep breath before properly introducing them on the next page.

‘its almost as if they knew we were coming’ - I find this chilling because… how were they warned?

There are a couple of elements of this in TSS - suggestions that the volunteers had some kind of secret knowledge or that everything was being very specially prepared. Compare also the way just one relevant scrap of paper from the library survived the burning - it doesn't seem like a coincidence, and yet how could it be arranged? Let's also not forget that the Verbal Fridge Dialogue pointing to a meeting on Thursday seems like it must have been prepared before the Thursday that the week of TSS takes place in (it starts on a Friday!).

Is this figurine the bombinating beast? Well, that would scupper my sugar bowl theory.

I suspect that it's just a coincidence. Besides, the figurine seller in TCC had loads of these figurines, it's just the one which contained important evidence.

Fernald doesn’t recognize the sinister duo, which is… odd

Should he? Do we know that they've ever met before? Probably the sinister duo are the most secretive of the villains of ASoUE; nobody even knows that they're the judges of the High Court, after all.

The VFDoor fits over the doorknob? Really? I don’t remember that. The chapter illustration gives the impression its much bigger than that…

It's easy to forget how the Vernacularly Fastened Door is actually supposed to work because Helquist's illustration is so strong - and yet, neither really make too much sense.

The telegram never arrived - Well… surely it did? But it was just ignored by Mr Poe, correct? And how can Quigley know this?

Same difference, arguably - but it's worth noting that the telegraph-chopping plot thread in the U.A. and TGG seems like it's being cited here as the reason the telegram never arrived, even though the U.A. also shows that the telegram in question did reach its destination. I suspect Handler took a liberty so that he could arrange the specific situation with Eleanora Poe, Mr. Poe being lied to in her name, her sending a telegram for help and so on.