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Post by Kit's tits kick ticks on Sept 19, 2013 17:57:33 GMT -5
Wow uh We were listing horrible horrible things that we would do to our enemies, which I think included torture and murder. In a thread like that how can you single out a specific post? Someone could have just as well picked a post that mentioned torture in THH (not 100% sure if that post exists) and go like 'hey you can't say that because of... Guantanamo'. We know rape is awful. It's kind of the point. Of course that seriously speaking, I wouldn't wish rape to my worst enemy, yet I wouldn't wish all the other stuff I said either. Well, anyway, I do see where you're coming from and I get this is a sensitive issue and I apologize if I took it too lightly. because rape is viewed differently than torture and murder. they're seen as clear crimes and people understand them in a way they don't understand rape. people don't say maybe the murdered person shouldn't have dressed that way, the murdered person was asking it or express sadness for a murderer when they are sentenced to jail for their crimes because they had a bright future ahead of them aside from the murder, oh let me see if i can find that thing from the onion. Maybe when a person is able to see rape mentioned in a row with all these other crimes and doesn't see a difference it shows that they do see it as a clear crime? Not all of these persons, but maybe some? Also I don't think all rape victims are completely innocent. But then I also don't think all murder or whatever victims were completely innocent. Actually I don't think any victim of a crime comitted by a not totally insane person is completely innocent.
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Post by BSam on Sept 19, 2013 17:59:28 GMT -5
people don't say maybe the murdered person shouldn't have dressed that way, the murdered person was asking it or express sadness for a murderer when they are sentenced to jail for their crimes because they had a bright future ahead of them aside from the murder, unless they murdered a black teenager in a hoody (/offtopic)
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Post by Poe's Coats Host Toast on Sept 19, 2013 18:01:33 GMT -5
Wow uh We were listing horrible horrible things that we would do to our enemies, which I think included torture and murder. In a thread like that how can you single out a specific post? Someone could have just as well picked a post that mentioned torture in THH (not 100% sure if that post exists) and go like 'hey you can't say that because of... Guantanamo'. We know rape is awful. It's kind of the point. Of course that seriously speaking, I wouldn't wish rape to my worst enemy, yet I wouldn't wish all the other stuff I said either. Well, anyway, I do see where you're coming from and I get this is a sensitive issue and I apologize if I took it too lightly. because rape is viewed differently than torture and murder. they're seen as clear crimes and people understand them in a way they don't understand rape. people don't say maybe the murdered person shouldn't have dressed that way, the murdered person was asking it or express sadness for a murderer when they are sentenced to jail for their crimes because they had a bright future ahead of them aside from the murder, oh let me see if i can find that thing from the onion. Just to make it clear, I agree that many people are like that and view rape as lesser crimes, but now you are stating that apparently we're the kind of people that don't understand this and you do and you need to tell us or we'll never know. I'm just saying that I think we're all on the same page on this here.
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Post by Charles Vane on Sept 19, 2013 18:02:42 GMT -5
the joke doesn't have to support his opinion. a joke can have implications the creator didnt realize. im just saying if you wanna discuss this, because this happens all the time where someone tells a joke and people are like that joke is offensive/sexist/rapey whatever and the person is like thats not what i meant you silly ladies calm your pretty little heads. I don't think it's fair to say that this was the case in MisterM's scenario however. i never said it did. i for once am trying to adhere to the purpose of a thread and talk about rape culture and humor. im using this joke because it's a handy example that happened at our own forum. ive said i wasnt saying his intention was to make a rape joke, we're talking about how the joke can be interpreted by others not how he meant it.
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Post by BSam on Sept 19, 2013 18:03:20 GMT -5
Also I don't think all rape victims are completely innocent. But then I also don't think all murder or whatever victims were completely innocent. Actually I don't think any victim of a crime comitted by a not totally insane person is completely innocent. so if someone is raped, is it in part because of the victim? because of what they are wearing or for going out late at night or drinking too much?
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Post by bandit on Sept 19, 2013 18:08:46 GMT -5
Also I don't think all rape victims are completely innocent. But then I also don't think all murder or whatever victims were completely innocent. Actually I don't think any victim of a crime comitted by a not totally insane person is completely innocent. Without being rape-specific, I can't think of any reason why a victim of a crime would not be innocent. Because they allowed themselves in the vicinity of a lawbreaker?
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Post by Poe's Coats Host Toast on Sept 19, 2013 18:08:59 GMT -5
I don't think it's fair to say that this was the case in MisterM's scenario however. i never said it did. Well, you implied it. Quite strongly. i for once am trying to adhere to the purpose of a thread and talk about rape culture and humor. im using this joke because it's a handy example that happened at our own forum. ive said i wasnt saying his intention was to make a rape joke, we're talking about how the joke can be interpreted by others not how he meant it. This is a moved thread, so it started out somewhere else and was off-topic at first, so it's tricky for me to ignore that. Also you have never put it the way you put it in the above quote before. You did talk about it as if it were his intention. If you had started this thread yourself with your disclaimer this whole thing would've been different. EDIT: Because it is indeed a good idea for (however serious) thread.
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Post by penne on Sept 19, 2013 18:09:36 GMT -5
because rape is viewed differently than torture and murder. they're seen as clear crimes and people understand them in a way they don't understand rape. people don't say maybe the murdered person shouldn't have dressed that way, the murdered person was asking it or express sadness for a murderer when they are sentenced to jail for their crimes because they had a bright future ahead of them aside from the murder, oh let me see if i can find that thing from the onion. Just to make it clear, I agree that many people are like that and view rape as lesser crimes, but now you are stating that apparently we're the kind of people that don't understand this and you do and you need to tell us or we'll never know. I'm just saying that I think we're all on the same page on this here. I don't think that's what she meant. I think she was just saying rape stands out because it's often viewed differently and people tend to make excuses for the rapist. Not that we think that way necessarily. you're kinda doing that thing where you say what someone else is thinking again. you gotta stop doing that, bro.
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Post by Poe's Coats Host Toast on Sept 19, 2013 18:14:27 GMT -5
Just to make it clear, I agree that many people are like that and view rape as lesser crimes, but now you are stating that apparently we're the kind of people that don't understand this and you do and you need to tell us or we'll never know. I'm just saying that I think we're all on the same page on this here. I don't think that's what she meant. I think she was just saying rape stands out because it's often viewed differently and people tend to make excuses for the rapist. Not that we think that way necessarily. you're kinda doing that thing where you say what someone else is thinking again. you gotta stop doing that, bro. This is getting inception-like meta. I know what you mean, but really what I said was that she was actually telling us what we are thinking, namely that we are the kind of people that underplay rape.
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Post by Charles Vane on Sept 19, 2013 18:14:35 GMT -5
because rape is viewed differently than torture and murder. they're seen as clear crimes and people understand them in a way they don't understand rape. people don't say maybe the murdered person shouldn't have dressed that way, the murdered person was asking it or express sadness for a murderer when they are sentenced to jail for their crimes because they had a bright future ahead of them aside from the murder, oh let me see if i can find that thing from the onion. Just to make it clear, I agree that many people are like that and view rape as lesser crimes, but now you are stating that apparently we're the kind of people that don't understand this and you do and you need to tell us or we'll never know. I'm just saying that I think we're all on the same page on this here. pen literally asked how i could single one post out in that thread, this is my answer. i felt like we just had a moment where we got each other and now you're already back to assuming what im doing. i never said you don't understand, i don't know what you know but im saying this stuff regardless. when i follow news i go to sites like jezebel and sociological contexts that have a bunch of posts about rape culture and why x thing that occurred was not okay. a lot of their content is basically preaching to the choir because some people like being aware and talking about this stuff.
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Post by bryan on Sept 19, 2013 18:16:34 GMT -5
Wow uh We were listing horrible horrible things that we would do to our enemies, which I think included torture and murder. In a thread like that how can you single out a specific post? Someone could have just as well picked a post that mentioned torture in THH (not 100% sure if that post exists) and go like 'hey you can't say that because of... Guantanamo'. We know rape is awful. It's kind of the point. Of course that seriously speaking, I wouldn't wish rape to my worst enemy, yet I wouldn't wish all the other stuff I said either. Well, anyway, I do see where you're coming from and I get this is a sensitive issue and I apologize if I took it too lightly. because rape is viewed differently than torture and murder. they're seen as clear crimes and people understand them in a way they don't understand rape. people don't say maybe the murdered person shouldn't have dressed that way, the murdered person was asking it or express sadness for a murderer when they are sentenced to jail for their crimes because they had a bright future ahead of them aside from the murder, oh let me see if i can find that thing from the onion. the really really funnysad part is that a few years later CNN brought this satire to life. www.theonion.com/video/college-basketball-star-heroically-overcomes-tragi,19097/ Wow! Yes I wanted to say something but I couldn't figure it out but I think you said what I feel I know murder is bad just like I know rape is bad. So the joke mayyyyy not have necessarily offended me although if I thought about implications it would have for those who don't take tape and tape culture seriously I wouldn't make a joke like it --------- From this point on I'm NOT TRYING TO CONVEY PERSONAL OPINIONS. Just wondering what you guys think. If you're in an environment with people who are only fully aware of rape culture and are 100% knowledgable in that rape is wrong... Are rape jokes okay? (An unrealistic scenario but pretend it's real.) Another question: If a girl is super drunk and says "I want to have sex with you" to a guy who is equally super drunk and he feels the same and then they have sex and she never asks to stop... The next morning can she say he raped her? Edit: tape culture
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Post by Charles Vane on Sept 19, 2013 18:17:52 GMT -5
Well, you implied it. Quite strongly. i for once am trying to adhere to the purpose of a thread and talk about rape culture and humor. im using this joke because it's a handy example that happened at our own forum. ive said i wasnt saying his intention was to make a rape joke, we're talking about how the joke can be interpreted by others not how he meant it. This is a moved thread, so it started out somewhere else and was off-topic at first, so it's tricky for me to ignore that. Also you have never put it the way you put it in the above quote before. You did talk about it as if it were his intention. If you had started this thread yourself with your disclaimer this whole thing would've been different. EDIT: Because it is indeed a good idea for (however serious) thread. it feels like you keep discussing semantics and people's actions, you're not actually arguing the content of the joke or rape jokes in general or rape culture in general. so like if its that all you have to say about it now, i think we're done with this part of the topic.
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Post by Charles Vane on Sept 19, 2013 18:22:08 GMT -5
bryan, jezebel.com/5925186/how-to-make-a-rape-jokemy computer is being a dick so i didnt re-read but part of why the author found the rape jokes she quotes okay is because none of them made fun of the victim and all the comics seemed to be aware of what they were discussing.
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Post by Poe's Coats Host Toast on Sept 19, 2013 18:22:36 GMT -5
This is a moved thread, so it started out somewhere else and was off-topic at first, so it's tricky for me to ignore that. Also you have never put it the way you put it in the above quote before. You did talk about it as if it were his intention. If you had started this thread yourself with your disclaimer this whole thing would've been different. EDIT: Because it is indeed a good idea for (however serious) thread. it feels like you keep discussing semantics and people's actions, you're not actually arguing the content of the joke or rape jokes in general or rape culture in general. so like if its that all you have to say about it now, i think we're done with this part of the topic. Um, I can only answer that with the comment you responded to, so yes, I think this part of the discussion is done. (EDIT: Although I did argue the content of the concerned joke.)
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Post by Charles Vane on Sept 19, 2013 18:28:37 GMT -5
because rape is viewed differently than torture and murder. they're seen as clear crimes and people understand them in a way they don't understand rape. people don't say maybe the murdered person shouldn't have dressed that way, the murdered person was asking it or express sadness for a murderer when they are sentenced to jail for their crimes because they had a bright future ahead of them aside from the murder, oh let me see if i can find that thing from the onion. Maybe when a person is able to see rape mentioned in a row with all these other crimes and doesn't see a difference it shows that they do see it as a clear crime? Not all of these persons, but maybe some? Also I don't think all rape victims are completely innocent. But then I also don't think all murder or whatever victims were completely innocent. Actually I don't think any victim of a crime comitted by a not totally insane person is completely innocent. i think i get what you're saying, and maybe innocent isn't the best word to describe it. yeah people who commit crimes have motives for what they do, its not just the senseless violence an insane person might cause, but i don't think its a person who has nice stuffs fault if they get robbed for having nice stuff. yes i get that they did something to, like, make the crime happen(not the best word choice but idk), ie having nice stuff but they aren't to blame. you can't help if you're the victim of the crime, the only way to avoid it would be to lock yourself in your house and even then you're still vulnerable to arson, theft, online scams, whatever. am i close-ish to what you were saying?
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